Hodge71 664 #1 Posted December 12, 2011 Hey all, I was able to get my lineset change for the hydro on my new to me 1973 18 auto. The problem I have is that after charging the battery overnight, it was conveniently dead when I went to pick the tractor up yesterday so I couldnt hear it run, but was assured that it ran when used last. How much fuel do the pumps on these things put out? It's barely trikling out of the fuel line when I disconnect it from the carb. I checked it before the filter and it does come out a very slight bit quicker but to me it seems too little. The fuel doesnt smell to good eitherand it looks like muddy water. I wouldn't say its totally skunked but I bet its on its way. I have learned a very valuable lesson here...NEVER, EVER BUY SOMETHING WITHOUT HEARING IT START AND RUN. I will never take someones word for it again, lIfe's lessons I guess... So any ideas on this thing I know nothing about the carb or the motor on these big Kohlers. I am going to drain the tank tomorrow and I'm getting new fuel lines and about 6 new filters but after that I'm lost. Is there a way to check the pump? All help would be greatly appreciated Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
can whlvr 993 #2 Posted December 13, 2011 well firsf of all definately drain that old fuel out,new lines and filter for sure,as you said,are you cranking the engine to see if the fuel pump is pumping,check the fuel tank for crude too,often the line gets plugged right where it leaves the tank,thats where you start too look,new lines and filter and you may have to take the pump apart to check for crap in there too,then the float bowl usually need cleaned too Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Trouty56 567 #3 Posted December 13, 2011 There is a manual and a parts list in the documents of this site for the K482 Kohler. I'd download them both if I were you. The fuel pump, if a vacuum pump, pumps fairly well. It does on mine. A carb kit is another thing I'd include with what Don suggested. It'll run....... Might wanna take the tank off, 4 nuts on the bottom, and really clean it out. Go get a new petcock. Napa has this stuff. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hodge71 664 #4 Posted December 13, 2011 Just wanted to inform you guys that I found out its supposed to have a mechanical fuel pump on it. Sometime during its life, it **** the bed and somebody put an electric fuel pump on it. It is coming on with the key but gas only dribbles out of the line. Thats why I asked about the volume of fuel this thing should be putting out. Gonna start from scratch tomorrow after work.I'll locate a NAPA around here somewhere and get a new petcock too. Thanks so much guys....More info to follow. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stevebo-(Moderator) 8,382 #5 Posted December 13, 2011 You may want to look into an electric aftermarket fuel pump. I had one on my auto 18 and never had an issue with getting fuel. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hodge71 664 #6 Posted December 13, 2011 Thats what is on it Steve. I just dont know how much its supposed to put out. I'm used to race cars that dump a gallon a second out of the damn thing. This little thing just dribbles Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rollerman 290 #7 Posted December 13, 2011 You don't need much flow, to much & the needle & seat in the carb won't stop the flow. I had a Napa electric fuel pump on a few of my former D's, seems like the rate of flow was 4 to 6 GPM? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hodge71 664 #8 Posted December 13, 2011 gas shouldnt look like chocolate milk Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rooster 191 #9 Posted December 13, 2011 You are supposed to pour the coffee out of the cup FIRST, then drain gas into it... :ychain: Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
fourwheels0 191 #10 Posted December 13, 2011 first drain all fuel,change fuel lines and filter. clean carb and fuel bowl. check the plug and points (if it has points). THEN try starting it. the fuel pump SHOULD shoot fuel out if it's working correctly (weather it's electric or manual). Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Trouty56 567 #11 Posted December 13, 2011 Whoa Steven...4-6 gal per minute....I'd have a hard time getting that out of my spigot....I think you mean 4 psi.....lol.... I did a little reading on low pressure pumps 'cause I too was interested in one for a tractor that has none and some are adjustable from 1 - 4 psi. You might get 10 - 20 gal an hour so at that rate if it is pumping say 20 oz a minute (10 gal/hour) or better then it should be ok. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hodge71 664 #12 Posted December 13, 2011 Ok guys heres the update on the D. I came home from work and hooked up a I.V. drip of hi octane that Johnny Gage woulda been proud of and tried to start it. Low and behold she fired up and after taking the choke of and ran her for a bit at half throttle she settled in to a lopey idle. After I shut it down, I then changed the lines and filter, pulled the petcock out of the tank and found the screen clogged with dirt and debris, drained the tank and put about a gallon of kerosene in it , took the tank off and threw some chain in it and strapped it to the wheel in my 416 with some bungees and took a slow ride up and down the road in front of my house. I drained all the kero out along with all the debris that the chain loosened up, flushed the tank with more kero until there was no crud in it when I dumped it out.. Reinstalled the tank and filled with fresh 93 octane with Seafoam in it. turned the key and she sprung to life. I ran it for about 15 minutes driving it up and down the hills around the house. It ran great, no leaks in the hydro or lines that I changed. The lines running to the mid lift leak a bit when I actuate it but are fine when I dont use it. But then.....it shut off and wouldnt start. It cranks over, but it wont fire. Got lotsa crystal clear fuel but no fire. I let it sit for about 5 minutes and went back and it fired right up and I ran it some more, actually about 6 minutes more and then it shut off again let it sit for 5 more minutes and it started right up again, took it around the house and parked it cuz it was dark. Any ideas as to what could cause this problem now? I'm so convinced that I was screwed on this thing. I cant picture that this thing supposedly just was running 2 months ago and now I have a gigantic boat anchor. Help please :confusion-helpsos: Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
can whlvr 993 #13 Posted December 14, 2011 first of all you are heading in the right direction,it runs and moves,do you try to start it with the choke after its hot,i imagine you tryed it but i had a few tractors that will only start with the choke on,even when hot.i would put a new set of plugs in her too,then go from there,maybe someone has some other insight to this problem,but you will get her,dont get discouraged,look at it as learning about your machine,you will know lots about her when you are done getting her running good Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hodge71 664 #14 Posted December 14, 2011 Wont start with choke on or off when she dies. It has new plugs and wires. I'm not understanding why it runs for awhile, shuts off, then after 5 minutes of sitting she fires right up again and runs like a top for a period again then croaks. Its not a stumble of a gradual death, it just dies right where it sits, like a switch is being flipped off. I really bought a lemon here. I shoulda known... :banghead: Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sparky-(Admin) 21,776 #15 Posted December 14, 2011 Could the coil be getting to hot ? Mike.......... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tunahead72 2,504 #16 Posted December 14, 2011 Jeff, Just checking, did you have an inline filter installed while you were running the Seafoam through the system? If not, you should -- even though you've cleaned your tank well, the Seafoam could have loosened up bits of hidden dirt/rust/whatever that could be clogging your fuel flow. If you do have a filter on there, does it look basically clean? Have you taken a close look at the carb, maybe it just needs a good cleaning/rebuild? It doesn't take much to clog the tiny openings in there. You might just try removing the fuel mixture screw(s), hit them with some spray carb cleaner, poke any holes you see with a tiny wire or similar, reinstall, adjust them properly and see what happens when you try to start it again. I wouldn't necessarily call this a lemon just yet, maybe just badly maintained. One step at a time, these machines usually respond well to a little tinkering. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hodge71 664 #17 Posted December 14, 2011 There is a brandy new clear inline filter and it has nothing in it other than crystal clear fuel. As far as the carb, I did nothing to it. To be honest , carbs scare the hell outta me I dont think its the carb, but I dont know anything compared to you guys, and with the deplorable condition of the rest of the machine I cant rule anything out. I can say it does need an idle adjustment cuz it wont run with the throttle all the way down. After work today I'm going to replicate the conditions and make it shut off and then check if I have spark. Could it be the coil or the condenser? I did feel the coil when it shut off yesterday and it was warm but to me it didnt seem hot or even overly warm. I guess we shall see today. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pfrederi 18,206 #18 Posted December 14, 2011 Get a $4 spark plug tester from Harbor Freight (a really useful tool) and see if you are getting spark during the hot restart attempts. if not I would suspect the coil and/or condenser. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rooster 191 #19 Posted December 14, 2011 ... shuts off, then after 5 minutes of sitting she fires right up again and runs like a top for a period again then croaks. Its not a stumble of a gradual death, it just dies right where it sits, like a switch is being flipped off.... When they "Shut off like a switch", that is electrical! When they cool down then start...that is the coil, almost every time! Many guys don't want to admit it, because fixing a wire is alot cheaper....but in the end they admit it, lol! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hodge71 664 #20 Posted December 14, 2011 Well here we go...More info as I troubleshoot.....AFter it shuts off there is definitely spark...just ask the arm that I grounded out and juiced myself...lol....anyhoo....I am now suspecting the electric fuel pump on it, as it doesnt keep the filter full and I pulled the hose off the tank and gas pours out of the petcock when opened. Yesterday when Istarted it for the first time the filter was filled instantly, now its back to a dribble. It wont even push fuel at all. I called my local Toro dealer and they can hook me up with a universay kohler pump for $124 after my discount, Does anyone have the napa part number for their electric fule pump? I must be missing it on the website and my local store is trying to sell me a inline car fuel pump. Its way to big for my needs. It has to be cheaper than this Kohler Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rooster 191 #21 Posted December 14, 2011 That is way to much to pay for a fuel pump. You can put a pulse pump on it for $30 that will run that engine plenty fine! If you really want electric, Mr. Gasket 12S, about $30 as well. Did you ever clean the carb...all that stuff in your fuel there has to be junk in the carb. You said it was parked for a couple of months, if there was much ethanol in the gas they left in it, that could be causing you problems as well. I still think it is the coil...lol. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hodge71 664 #22 Posted December 14, 2011 Rooster, I'm not saying I disagree with you but in order to get it to run long enough I need to fix the fuel issue first. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Paul D. 26 #23 Posted December 14, 2011 You may want to check the clearance on the valves. If its too tight as the engine heats up and things start expanding they may not be seating correctly. You will get it. And it will be worth it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Trouty56 567 #24 Posted December 15, 2011 Take the tank off again and secure it above the engine. Run the fuel line from the tank thru the filter and to the carb. If it runs off gravity then the pump is the problem. Napa has one for half of that price from Toro. I have a vacuum pump on my K482. Search low pressure fuel pumps fleabay. 1-3 psi should do it. There are pumps for less than 20. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
can whlvr 993 #25 Posted December 15, 2011 what bob just said,try gravity,and hopefully you can get it to run,and definatly clean the carb, Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
