Martin 2,132 #1 Posted December 7, 2011 started working on rebuilding the 1057. pulled the 3 speed apart to do seals and bearings and need some help with id on the diff assembly. cant find any pics in the manual that shows a diff that looks the same as this. did a search on here in the trans section and am getting tired of reading and searching. its got the wide gear like some of the centers ive seen but the caps are different. through the two holes in the end caps it looks like a bevel gear center, but the manual shows the bevel gear with a narrow ring gear. any help on this would be appreciated. just trying to learn a little more about what ive got. its got the 1 1/8 axles and im assuming its a 5085 from the manual. the trans will be the first part tackled and then i will move on to the frame and start building from there. will post soon in the resto section as i get into it a bit. case ready to blast and powder. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sorekiwi 761 #2 Posted December 7, 2011 Thats a bevel gear diff Martin. In the last couple of months I've pulled 2 apart that were working fine, but both had cracks in the end housings, and had broken flanges on the thingies that retain the pin through the spiders. My project was a hydro for my 1276 Loader, I'll go with an 8 pinion instead. Its a shame though, I really like the way the bevel gear diff's work. BTW thats the same diff as what should be in your 1054, they are fairly notorious for giving problems. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Martin 2,132 #3 Posted December 7, 2011 So do you think that this was the original setup for this 1057? From the manual the parts breakdown pic it looks like the ring gear is narrower than the one on this trans.. Thanks for your input. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sorekiwi 761 #4 Posted December 7, 2011 I have a 1257 trans sitting in the corner of the garage, but havent opened it up yet to see whats inside. But I am reasonably sure that what you show is standard for that tractor. The 2 diffs I have pulled apart were both from 1276 hydro tractors, the ring gear part # is 2821, the same as what parts tree lists for the 1057 (and the 1054). My ring gears measure 1 3/4" wide across the teeth. For reference a later model 8 pinion ring gear measures 1 7/8" across the teeth). An interesting thread that is kinda related is this one: The source, Wild Bill, has forgotten more about these tractors than I will ever know, but I believe he is wrong when he states "The Wheel Horse models that used the Uni-Drive model 5058 are as follows 1057 and 1257. The 5045, 5047 and 5051 in the 953, 1054 and 1054A (well you knew that one ) are of the same configuration as a 5058 and will interchange. " (End of Quote). The part numbers of the axles are different between the 1054 and 1057 trans, and I am sure that the 1057 axles are shorter than the ones used on the 1054. Maybe you can confirm that for us since you have both sitting in your shop? My 1054 has an 8 speed in it so I am unable to confirm this, but from pictures it looks like the 1054 axles stick out of the trans a lot further than the 1067 ones. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Martin 2,132 #5 Posted December 7, 2011 I will check on the axle length but I'm almost 100% sure the 1054 is noticeably longer. Plus the hubs are longer. Then there is the different bolt pattern to the frame...... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Martin 2,132 #6 Posted December 7, 2011 I'm looking forward to putting this one together. Was a piece of cake to pull apart, with the manual at my side and many a stevasaurus video watched...... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sorekiwi 761 #7 Posted December 7, 2011 It'll be interesting to see if there is anything torn up inside the diff, I was really surprised to find both of mine rooted, both were driving fine. If you need bits for the diff, some of my bits are reuseable... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
racinfool40 202 #8 Posted December 7, 2011 Just just rebuilt a 1054 tranny for a fellow member and the axles are definitly longer than on a 1057's tranny...Just shipped a complete bevel gear differential to another menber who had his basically explode.. These diffs are definitly a weak spot in these tranny's.. Good Luck on your rebuild Martin.. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
joebob 45 #9 Posted December 7, 2011 hope it dont look like this Thanks Mike! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Martin 2,132 #10 Posted December 9, 2011 well i havent got into the differential yet, that can wait till the weekend. got a set of bearings and seals from motion industries (minus the two big bearings....) for around $72. also got the case and other associated parts powder coated. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Martin 2,132 #11 Posted December 12, 2011 Got the differential apart. Couldn't see any excessive wear or anything that stands out. The bevel gears look like they have hardly any wear at all. So what do you guys that know these things think? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
racinfool40 202 #12 Posted December 13, 2011 :handgestures-thumbupright: Looks Good to me Martin!!! One of the better one's I"ve seen!!!! Looks like your goin in the right direction!!!! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sorekiwi 761 #13 Posted December 13, 2011 A little too hard to see what the teeth look like in the first picture. WH isnt known for a fine finish on their gear teeth anyway! Everything in the second picture looks good to me too. Neither of the diffs I pulled apart had that mark on the end of the axle, I assume it was floating in far enough to hit the pin through the spiders. I dont think it is an issue though. Have a good look for cracks in the outer housings of the diff, both of mine were cracked, but they were big, clearly visible cracks. I'd also look closely at the flanges on the thingies that retain the pin. In the pictures I posted above you can see where mine were broken. Also my outer housings and the ring gears on both of mine showed signs of fretting where all the bits clamp together. I dont see any signs of that in your second picture. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Martin 2,132 #14 Posted December 13, 2011 The only thing questionable that I seen inside there is the slight play I noticed in the gears. It's not bad, but there is some there....I've got it back together now and really think that I need to leave well enough alone though........ Overall I'm happy this was a good outcome, let's hope there's a few years left in it..... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sorekiwi 761 #15 Posted December 13, 2011 The only thing questionable that I seen inside there is the slight play I noticed in the gears. It's not bad, but there is some there It provides some clearance for some oil to get in there! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Martin 2,132 #16 Posted December 13, 2011 Neither of the diffs I pulled apart had that mark on the end of the axle, I assume it was floating in far enough to hit the pin through the spiders. I dont think it is an issue though. mike, that mark on the end of the axles ( it was on both of them) i couldnt find where on the pin it could have made that mark by rubbing. in fact the only rubbing marks on either the axle or the pin was some slight circular ones in a bigger diameter than the square shape of this mark (like the end of the axle).... this small square shaped mark was recessed slightly in the axle, but the pin was smooth, its hard to see the pin on the first pic because of the focus, but the slight darkening is relatively smooth and center, whereas that mark in the axle is off set. could this have been in the end of the axle already? maybe the axles were swapped from another diff earlier on in its life, or maybe they have always been there? who knows......... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stevasaurus 22,767 #17 Posted December 14, 2011 Great thread guys. I have yet to open one of these tranmissions. Martin, I take it your large bearings are OK. I like the powder coating look. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Martin 2,132 #18 Posted December 14, 2011 Steve, large ones are good. I probably could have got away with only replacing the axle and input shaft bearings as the rest looked ok. It was just easier with blasting and powder coating to only have to seal off the large ones and remove the rest. I'm really surprised how good the trans is considering the rest of the tractor is almost worn out. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Martin 2,132 #19 Posted December 14, 2011 have a question regarding the hi and 2nd and low and reverse gears. they have wear from what looks like grinding the gears over the years. i removed all the burrs and sharp edges and cleaned them up. might even take them to work and blast them to blend the marks. i posted some pics so i can show what condition they are in. the tractor wont be getting any hard working, probably be leading a life of luxury..... is it really neccessary to replace them? opinions needed please.... if i need to replace them id rather do it while its apart. Here's the pics Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
racinfool40 202 #20 Posted December 14, 2011 Martin. In my opinion I would re-use them...They don't look to bad to me!!! Ive seen them alot worse!!! Once you see what new one's cost and if you can find them, I think you will re-use them! :handgestures-thumbupright: Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Martin 2,132 #21 Posted December 14, 2011 I really don't want to replace them if they will do the job. I've cleaned up the rough edges and maybe will take them to work and blast them. Thanks for your opinion. I think with the use they will get they should be fine. Seized bearings are one thing, but the rest of the trans was working ok and never gave an indication of hard gear engagement. (null) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Martin 2,132 #22 Posted December 14, 2011 Another question. Installing bearings. Do all the bearings on the side of the case go flush with the inside? This is how they were installed when I took it apart. The input shaft almost looks like it needs another bearing alongside it. (null) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sorekiwi 761 #23 Posted December 14, 2011 I really don't want to replace them if they will do the job. I've cleaned up the rough edges and maybe will take them to work and blast them. I think they will be fine. I do exactly what you said, smooth the sharp edges over to minimise the chance of chipping, and call it good, I'm not sure I would bother blasting them, where the metal has been removed there is no contact with the other tooth, so I dont think you need to blend it all in. Take a look at the teeth on the inside of the input shaft gear as well (the other half of top gear). You havent showed that in your pictures. If those teeth get a bit of a taper worn on them it can jump out of top gear. But if it wasnt jumping out before, chances are it'll be fine now, especially with nice new bearings keeping everything lined up straight. I dont recall anything weird about an input shaft bearing, I just knock them in a hair past flush with the inside of the trans. Do you have the seal installed yet? Is it the same width as the old one? I think I have a 3 speed case in the corner of the garage. If I can convince my aching back and throbbing hernia to do it, I'll wander out that way and have a look when I have finished my beer! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Martin 2,132 #24 Posted December 15, 2011 some pics of the seals and bearings installed and gears. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Martin 2,132 #25 Posted December 15, 2011 I dont recall anything weird about an input shaft bearing, I just knock them in a hair past flush with the inside of the trans. Do you have the seal installed yet? Is it the same width as the old one? all the bearings and seals were identical to the old stuff, even had the same markings and part #s on the sides.....feels nice to put back in exactly what came out, instead of a little difference here and a little there. nice to be using steel seals instead of the plastic like comes in the kohler rebuild kits now. all these little things add up to a good first time experience at doing a trans. had one minor hiccup though, managed to mangle the last seal putting in, an axle seal on the brake side of the case. after an easy install on the others this one was giving me grief and i got a litte impatient and caught it on the edge of the axle housing and it twisted slightly. needed a little more of a deburring on the opening. oh well will grab another on my next order from motion industries. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
