Axel Seal Still Leaking

[MalMac 1,331]

I replaced a drive Axel seal on C-141 8 speed. The thing is still leaking. Now I have done three or four of these before with no problem. Now what I wondering is if the Axel is wore where the seal rides. I checked the Axel for play and the only play is the normal in and out. No front to back or up and down. I did notice that where the old seal was riding was very shiny. One thing that is different on this tractor vs. the other ones I have done is this tractor has a loader on it. Wonder if that has something to do with it, having all that weight back there. I did make sure like I always do, is make sure the axel was clean and smooth. Use a little oil to help slide the seal on. Anybody have this happen to them? If so what did you do to correct the problem.

[rmaynard 15,606]

What brand of seals did you use? I have recently had issues with Toro's seals leaking. I replaced them with seals from NAPA, and the problem was solved.

I'm sure you know this, but it never hurts to repeat it. Be sure that there are no burrs on the edges of the key slot that may cut the seal when installed.

[farmer 1,075]

This is really interesting, ( I would think your problem is with the seal or maybe a slight burr on the axle) but when you say its a loader tractor, it could be the weight tranfer changes as you use the loader?.

I've not seen a loader to be able to tell, but the on/off load on the rear axle might exaggerate any wear thats present. :woohoo:

[Save Old Iron 1,566]

Try doubling up on the seals before removing the first set. The 2nd set of seals will end up in an new position on the axle, hopefully on a suitable area to effect a better oil tight seal.

[rmaynard 15,606]

Try doubling up on the seals before removing the first set. The 2nd set of seals will end up in an new position on the axle, hopefully on a suitable area to effect a better oil tight seal.

The last time I checked, the recessed area for an axle seal on a 103916 transmission was only deep enough for one seal.

[Save Old Iron 1,566]

Guess I consider myself lucky I was able to get two into mine and save a bunch on buying new axles?

[MalMac 1,331]

When I put the seal on I thought about doubling up. When I seen how much room was left I just did not think there was enough. Maybe the bearing needs to be pressed in further. I not 100% sure on this but I thought the parts diagram on the last of the Wheel Horse's to be produce showed that two seals per side were used.

rmaynard might have something there about the seals not being up to par. Just my opinion is when I got the seals form a dealer I thought they looked just a little thin and cheaper than the last set I had bought. Wish there was room to double up. Like said, that way the seal would be riding on a different spot.

[rmaynard 15,606]

When I put the seal on I thought about doubling up. When I seen how much room was left I just did not think there was enough. Maybe the bearing needs to be pressed in further. I not 100% sure on this but I thought the parts diagram on the last of the Wheel Horse's to be produce showed that two seals per side were used.

rmaynard might have something there about the seals not being up to par. Just my opinion is when I got the seals form a dealer I thought they looked just a little thin and cheaper than the last set I had bought. Wish there was room to double up. Like said, that way the seal would be riding on a different spot.

With a seal properly install, and completely seated, it will sit flush or recessed up to 1/16" below the surface, not nearly enough room for another seal.

Here is a picture from the parts manual showing one single seal for the 103916 transmission.

The Toro seals that I had originally purchased are all plastic. The NAPA seals, which are manufactured by Chicago Rawhide, are made from stainless steel. There's a huge difference in quality. Last three transmissions that I put seals in, I used the NAPA parts and have had no issues with leakage.

[MalMac 1,331]

Bob I think you got something there. These seals I got to put in just plain looked cheap compared to the last ones I got. They just seemed for lack of better words too flexible. Think I'll head to NAPA and give them a try. I know the last seals I got from Toro did have steel outer ring like the old ones that I replaced on other tractors. The one I took out of this tractor was steel. The new one I put in that leaks was not even close to what came out. Thanks for the heads up on the NAPA seals. I guess the saying "They just don't make'em like they used to " applies here.

[tommy3horse 3]

Hi guys;

I know I maybe hijacking a bit, but I am trying to replace the axel seals on my C120 auto. I pulled the hub and tried to pull the old seal. The outer steel ring peeled out easily. But the rubber is still in the pocket. I have been gently digging at it and I finally have it clean. The new seals I got from NAPA are very thin and dont appear to be big enough on the O.D.. The I.D. is a perfect fit to the axel though.

So, I must have gotten the wrong seals...maybe for a manual tranny. The NAPA part #11050, which I learned from a thread on replacing seals.

Does anyone know for sure?

Thanks in advance,

Tom

:D

[rmaynard 15,606]

Edit: see next post

[rmaynard 15,606]

The part number is 6449. Please see this post from TT.

http://www.wheelhorseforum.com/index.php?...=0entry192669

Try NAPA #11124

[tommy3horse 3]

Thanks Bob! :woohoo:

[tarcoleo 119]

(1-1/8) CR 11050 (NAPA) worked for me.

Tom in RI :woohoo:

[rmaynard 15,606]

Toro #100442, SKF #11050

Description:

Shaft: 1.125

Bore: 1.375

OD: 1.379

Width: 0.125

Toro #6449, SKF #11124

Description:

Inches

Shaft: 1.125

Bore: 1.624

OD: 1.628

Width:0.256

As you can see, although the inside diameter is the same, there is a big difference in the two. The one for the manual transmissions (100442) has a 1-3/8" outside diameter, and is not as thick (1/8"). The one for the automatic transmission (6449) has a larger outside diameter (1-5/8") and is a little over a 1/4" thick.

[MalMac 1,331]

I went down to my local NAPA and found the store closed because of some water problem so I went to an independent parts store. They carried the National Seal brand. I have used these seals before and they are a good seal. National Seal is made by Federal Mogal, they make alot of name brand parts and high performance parts.

The part number for the National Seal is- 340835

With the part prices sky rocketing from Toro and some of the OEM parts not quite being up to snuff. I have started a note book with part names and cross over numbers. I think as Toro starts to discontinue items we will be looking to aftermarket more and more. Maybe this should be a subject with is own heading here on Red Square where members can go and post what they have found to work along with the brand name and part number. I believe that some thing like this will be needed in order to keep the tractors and this hobby going long after Toro pulls the plug.

[rmaynard 15,606]

There are a lot of threads which deal with cross-references, but I think that you have a good idea. There should be a section devoted strictly to cross-referencing of Wheel Horse/Toro parts. It should be easy to find, or at least easy to search for. I know we have members with the talent to put all the info into a very readable, and understandable format.

Good idea. :woohoo: