Axle movement question

[multihobbyguy 35]

I purchased new seals for the rear of my 867 and was wondering how much play up and down is acceptable. I measure it at about .01". I have read that if it moves too much it will ruin the new seals but was not sure what too much was. Here is some picture to help. As always, Thanks, Chris.

[300zx 7]

Chris, my 857 began to leak after I got it back in 1985. I can't remember how much play there was, but my dealer said he always replaced the seal with two, one behind the other. I did and it hasn't leaked again. My son still uses it. Other may have better recommendations, but this may be a fix until you are ready to tear it down and check the needle bearings.

John

[pfrederi 17,868]

Up and down play isn't good, however I have never measured it that precisely. Is it the same on both sides? If it is I would put in the seals and chalk it up to 50 years of use. If there is a significant difference then one needle bearing may be going bad.

[Actonhorse 26]

If you don't want to do a tear down right now, you can just replace the seals and see what happens, they aren't too pricey. One thing you can do is make sure that there are no burs on the axles especially around the keyway that will cut the new seal as you put them on.

[jimbotelho 1]

guys i had the same issue leaking axle seal and lost the needle bearings I installed a brass/ bronze bushing and I am waiting for the seals to come to see how it works out. my feeling is that the axle does not spin very fast and the shim stock I used may be the solution . the size shim stock is 11/8 x1 3/8 by 1/2 I had to grind the outside down to fit in the housing . all measurements are id and od hope it works and will let everyone know when I finish it up jim

[stevasaurus 22,863]

guys i had the same issue leaking axle seal and lost the needle bearings I installed a brass/ bronze bushing and I am waiting for the seals to come to see how it works out. my feeling is that the axle does not spin very fast and the shim stock I used may be the solution . the size shim stock is 11/8 x1 3/8 by 1/2 I had to grind the outside down to fit in the housing . all measurements are id and od hope it works and will let everyone know when I finish it up jim

I would like to see some pictures of this...not sure it will work. Thinking you will not get enough lubrication.

[jimbotelho 1]

STEVE, IT IS NO DIFFERENT THAN THE NEEDLE BEARINGS BEING LUBED ONLY DIFFERENCE IS THERE IS A BUSHING AFTER THE NEEDLE BEARINGS THEN THE SEAL ONLY DOUBiT i i HAVE ARE THE NEEDLE BEARINGS FLOATING AROUND INSIDE THE CASE AND CAN CAUSE PROBLEMS i AM THINKING OF GETTING A MAGNETIC PLUG TO PICK UP ANY METAL THAT MAY BE LURKING LET YOU KNOW SEALS SHOULD BE HERE TOMORROW JIM

[multihobbyguy 35]

There are metal lathes that run on bronze bearings that last for years. They run them at all speeds and have a pretty good load on the from time to time. I know eventually they started manufacturing with needle bearings but they did last a long time with the bronze bearings.

[stevasaurus 22,863]

I hear you guys...brass bushings are great when they are lubed enough. Here is my thought...that outer axle bearing and the casting that holds it is above the level of the 90 wt oil, or real close to it. The oil has to go through and around the 1533 ball bearing and down that axle housing to get to that outer axle bearing. That is why I am a little leery about this. I think it is a great idea, if it works. Remember, there exists a couple brass bushings/bearings in the cluster gear complex already, but they lay in the oil. :WRS:

[jimbotelho 1]

T HANKS GUYS i GUESS WE WILL HAVE TO SEE HOW IT HOLDS UP IF NOT APART THE TRANNY COMES HERES HOPING jIM :hide:

[shorts 182]

are you using brass or oilite bronze bushing material that is impregnated and intended to be used for bearings?

the other thing that i see is the dial indicater should be back as close to the axle housing/seal area to get an accurate measurement of movement/wear at the bearing/seal. with the indicater at the end of the axle you will see greater movement because you are farther away from the bearing/fulcrom.

[jimbotelho 1]

ok here is where Im at replaced the seal installed hub etc put mower deck on and cut my lawn. when i got through guess what happened. The bushing and seal came out of the housing. I installed another seal and I guess I will have to see what happens Can someone tell me how far the seal should go in to the housing? I saw a thread where a dealer installs 2 seals thanks I may need the rear replaced as this little 8horse kohler does a nteriffic lob with a 36in rear dc deck Im liking it :hide:

[redtin 0]

Interesting the bronze bush could work

I hand quite a bit of up down play put new seal in and has had heavy use six months no leak as yet.

Dan

[mo.ozark.farmer 0]

Having similar issue with my D-180.

Left axle seal began leaking horribly, pulled the hubs and the seal.

There is only a third of the exposed surface of the bearing I can see once removing the seal. found the other two thirds of the outershell jammed in between where the seal was and the casing. putting the puzzle of metal together I could make out "made in usa" " Torrington B-1816.

I assume this is the needle bearing and it has experience a catastrophic failure.

The third of the bearings outer shell that I can see left is on the very bottom. So to see if I could at least test the tractor out, I installed a new seal after cleaning up the axle. On the jackstands I can fill up the transaxle with fluid and no leaks. However there is enough play in this left axle that I can push it up a little and the fluid sneaks between the new seal and the axle. So if I put the hubs and wheels back on and set her down , she will just bleed out.

So, correct me if I am wrong, does this mean I have to drop the drivetrain, split the case and replace the needle bearings from the inside. I assume there is a good chance theres are some bearing parts floating around that need to be cleaned out too.

How many different seals, gaskets, etc.... will I have to replace since I am pulling it apart?

Am I better off finding a mechanic or can a first timer doing surgery on a wheel horse handle this ?

Thanks,

Steve

[pfrederi 17,868]

If your needle bearing failed then immediately STOP using the tractor. Those needles can cause very expensive damage to other bearings the axle shafts etc!!!

If you have removed the hubs one of the hardest parts is done. Removing the transmission and splitting the case is not terrible difficult from a mechanical stand point. It is messy (you have to clean the outside of the unit and no matter how long you let it drain oil will come out as out start disassembly) and the tranny is heavy. Also you need a very clean place to work hydros and dirt do not mix!!!

It isn't an afternoon project. The sundstrand hydro manual provides all the info you need.

You should plan on checking/replacing the differential bolts as long as you are in there