C-120 Doesnt Want to Go

[Clarkbug 0]

Hello all!

New to the boards, as I have just today picked up a new-to-me C-120. Based on what the Toro web page is telling me, it says its a 1976. (Model 61-12K804). There is also a number 6139, but I dont know what thats all about.

It came with the deck (I want to say a model 728 if that makes sense....) and a plow blade, but Im not sure of the model for that.

Anyway, while taking it off of the truck today, it would barely even move in reverse. It just really didnt want to go at all. The transmission was solidly in gear, it just felt like it wasnt headed any place. Im guessing its something to do with the clutch linkage or transmission belt, but this is my first Wheel Horse, so I wanted to ask where I should start.

Thanks in advance for any/all help!

[TT-(Moderator) 1,145]

:ychain:

How well does it move in the three forward gears? (in either high or low range)

[Clarkbug 0]

How well does it move in the three forward gears? (in either high or low range)

Thanks for the welcome!

It moved OK in the forward gears. I really had to get on the throttle to get it going, and all I was really doing was moving it into the garage (slight downhill grade most of the way). I wouldnt think there is any kind of centrifugal clutch on these, but I could definitely be wrong....

[TT-(Moderator) 1,145]

The 8 speeds are very slow in low range - especially when in 1st or reverse. Check that before anything else & we'll go from there. :ychain:

[btrrg1969 11]

:ychain:

[Clarkbug 0]

Thanks for the additional welcome!

I believe that its slow, but I guess that I should have been more specific... I was backing it off of the truck, and to do that I had to put some planks down. It didnt want to make its way up onto those planks at all. It just hit them and stopped. The clutch was out, the engine didnt die down, it just sorta sat there.

Its almost like the clutch is slipping. The gentleman I bought it from said that he was going to replace the transmission belt, but he just had to replace some adjustment spring. Would that have anything to do with it?

[Sparky-(Admin) 21,405]

Try pulling back on the clutch pedal with your foot. If it goes allright after that you should probably get a new belt and spring. If your keeping this tractor you'll have the new belt for years as they really last a long time.

Mike.......

[TT-(Moderator) 1,145]

There isn't an actual clutch - the pedal controls a tensioner pulley mounted to an arm under the belt guard. A spring mounted on the left side pulls the arm back, the pedal pulls it forward.

It's possible that the belt is slipping, but it should affect operation in either direction.

There are woodruff keys driving the rear wheel hubs and sometimes one of them will shear. The easiest way to check them (other than removing each hub) is to draw a line across the end of both axles / wheel hubs. Try moving the tractor a few times and then look at the lines. If one of them no longer lines up, the key is sheared.

There is also a key at the input pulley/input shaft on the transaxle that can shear. Once again, both directions of operation should be affected.

If none of the above are found to be the problem, it's likely to be an internal issue in the tranz.

[Clarkbug 0]

Thanks for the tips everyone.

Im pretty sure its just something thats out of adjustment. I didnt hear any belt squeal or anything like that, so it doesnt sound like its slipping. The clutch and brake pedals go all the way down pretty easily, so they probably just need some adjusting.

There isnt anything centrifugally powered on these machines, right? I only ask since I wasnt at full throttle or anything when I was trying to move, it was idled down.

I need to pull off the back fenders as it is, since there is a lot of grass clippings and whatnot... I want to fire up the compressor and blow all that out, as well as do the usual maintenance stuff. (oil, air filter, spark plug, trans oil). For some reason the trans cap doesnt want to seat on the filler neck, and Im worried there is some badness in there, but we will see.

Really I just wanted to know where to look first as far as an adjustment goes. While typing these, I have been hunting down the manuals from some of the sites on the web and doing some reading.

It also looks like I need to get the steering shaft support welded, as thats cracked where it bolts to the frame, and I need to figure out what mower deck and snow plow I have so I can figure out how the heck to unhook one and hook up the other....

Regardless, Im sure that I will be back with more questions!

[TT-(Moderator) 1,145]

Nope - nothing centrifugal. When the clutch pedal is released, the tractor should move regardless of engine RPM.

There is no adjustment other than pedal position. If the drive belt is slipping, you'll need a new belt.

[Clarkbug 0]

Thanks again for the heads up!

Ill pull the fenders off to get a good look at things sometime soon and report back with the findings!

[Anglo Traction 761]

New to the boards, as I have just today picked up a new-to-me C-120. Based on what the Toro web page is telling me, it says its a 1976. (Model 61-12K804). There is also a number 6139, but I dont know what thats all about.

Just looking at your initial post and the Numbers. The 4 digit # is likely to be the 'Julien' build date of your Tractor. The 6 = unit year 197(6) . The 139 part = 139th day of 1976, which was a leap year. So yours was scheduled to be constructed on May 18th 1976.

Good luck with solving your drive problem....oh and :ychain:

[B-8074 19]

:ychain: Where are you locaited? I only ask because there might be a memeber that lives close by that may be able to take a look at the tractor. There are alot of helpfull people here. Good luck.

[Clarkbug 0]

Thanks for the info on the build date! A related question is going to be "What do all of the numbers on my mower deck mean?" I would really like to get a manual for it so I can know the correct way to take the thing on and off, and what parts I would need for it.

I live in upstate NY, about an hour N-NE of Albany, NY.

[Clarkbug 0]

So I finally had some time to start wrenching on the ol' girl, and found a number of things Ill need to fix.

But obviously, I want things to move first, before I worry about all of that other stuff.

So it appears to me that perhaps its an issue of the drive belt length or the spring tension for the clutch assembly. Is there a spec for how much the belt should deflect when the clutch pedal isnt pushed down?

I pulled the belt guard off so I could see how things work, and the belt tension is the only thing I could see that may be an issue.

Ill start some other threads on the other things I havent been able to figure out yet :ychain:

[Anglo Traction 761]

Hi, I assume you had not seen it being driven prior to buying it.

The Drive Belt Tension is provided by the Spring attached to the rear left side of the Transmission, and it attaches to the Clutch Idler pivot Rod also on the left side in front of the Brake Drum/Band. Check the Spring and Linkage.

Your Drive Belt is Part #7473 and should be 81.90" measured around the outside face. You may have the wrong belt on it?.

While the Guard is off, check the Fit of the Belt in all 3 Pulleys (Engine/Idler/Trans) .

The Belt outer face should be 5/8" wide and sit proud of the edge of the Engine Pulley, so the Tabs on the Engine End of the Guard can contact the Belt when the Clutch Pedal is depressed (disengaged). The Tabs must not touch the outer edge of that Pulley. If all this is ok, then the problem may lie elsewhere.

[Clarkbug 0]

Hi, I assume you had not seen it being driven prior to buying it.

The Drive Belt Tension is provided by the Spring attached to the rear left side of the Transmission, and it attaches to the Clutch Idler pivot Rod also on the left side in front of the Brake Drum/Band. Check the Spring and Linkage.

Your Drive Belt is Part #7473 and should be 81.90" measured around the outside face. You may have the wrong belt on it?.

While the Guard is off, check the Fit of the Belt in all 3 Pulleys (Engine/Idler/Trans) .

The Belt outer face should be 5/8" wide and sit proud of the edge of the Engine Pulley, so the Tabs on the Engine End of the Guard can contact the Belt when the Clutch Pedal is depressed (disengaged). The Tabs must not touch the outer edge of that Pulley. If all this is ok, then the problem may lie elsewhere.

Thanks for the quick and detailed replies! (to this and my other thread!)

I did not actually drive the tractor before I bought it, but it was driven up into my truck, and I was able to off load it, albeit with some trouble. Thats what started me on this thread.

On a flat surface, it will move back and forth with no problem, but as soon as there was any type of load or resistance, no go. The guy I bought it from said that he thought it needed a new transmission belt, but he put a new spring on it instead and that seemed to fix it. However, its just a random spring I think he had laying around, and Im not convinced its the correct one. When I looked at the diagram from PartsTree, it said that the spring was no longer available. Any idea of a suitable replacement, aside from trial and error at the hardware store?

I have pulled the guards off to see how things looked, and to try and tinker with some of the other bits on the tractor as well. (For instance, the entire area around the shifter was packed full of grass clippings and pine needles. Not good) So now would be the time to change the belt I suppose if it needs it. Ill take a look at it in the morning in regards to the items you mentioned.

Any advice on which belts seem to work best for replacement? Is this one of those instances where a Toro belt is better than any of the other manufacturers?

[WheelHorse_of_course 99]

If the problem is the spring you'll be able to tell because pulling up on the pedal with your foot will then make it run.

If it does not work with the pedal pulled up replace the belt and then see how it goes and then see if you need to change the spring.

:ychain:

[Clarkbug 0]

If the problem is the spring you'll be able to tell because pulling up on the pedal with your foot will then make it run.

If it does not work with the pedal pulled up replace the belt and then see how it goes and then see if you need to change the spring.

Well that makes sense... I wish I had thought of that in the first place! Now I just need to get it put back together enough to get a seat on it to try that idea out!

[Anglo Traction 761]

Any advice on which belts seem to work best for replacement? Is this one of those instances where a Toro belt is better than any of the other manufacturers?

As for the Belt, I have used Toro's (mine are the same #7473 as yours). The one I've just purchased is different to my previous one. They have now fully Wrapped the belt with Kevlar. This is supposed to help reduce noise and wear. I don't have any knowledge of other Makers Belts.

Over here (UK) we have to pay equivilent to $45.00 for one.

Hope you resolve your issue soon.

[jomama 0]

I just purchased a new Kevlar #7473 belt attractor supply for $22.00 Plus tax.

[C-Series14 15]

Hello all!

New to the boards, as I have just today picked up a new-to-me C-120. Based on what the Toro web page is telling me, it says its a 1976. (Model 61-12K804). There is also a number 6139, but I dont know what thats all about.

It came with the deck (I want to say a model 728 if that makes sense....) and a plow blade, but Im not sure of the model for that.

Anyway, while taking it off of the truck today, it would barely even move in reverse. It just really didnt want to go at all. The transmission was solidly in gear, it just felt like it wasnt headed any place. Im guessing its something to do with the clutch linkage or transmission belt, but this is my first Wheel Horse, so I wanted to ask where I should start.

Thanks in advance for any/all help!

Just to explain the VIN number and the other numbers on the ID tag a little. 61-12K804 is the VIN or model number. "61-" tells you it is a 1976 Garden Tractor, the "6" being the year and the "1" telling you it is a Garden Tractor. The "12" tells you the HP, the "K" tells you it is a Kohler, "8" is for 8-Speed, and "04" is for the parts list code. Anglo told you about the manufacture date...

[Kelly 1,029]

Don't forget to reinstall the belt guard for your test run, the guard helps with, clutch operation, take your toe and pull back on the pedal to see if it drives better, I like WH belts on stick shift tractors, hydros aftermarket work fine.

[dgjks6 6]

So, did it work?

[Clarkbug 0]

Sorry for the delay in a reply!

I actually have had to travel for work this past week, and was gone all weekend up until last night.

So no wrenching for me

Im hoping to get a few hours in after work this week, but we are also supposed to get hit with a snow storm starting tomorrow night, so I may be on snow removal duty instead...

As soon as I get a chance, Ill post back with results.