Paint surface quality

[HankB 16]

This came up in Bob's thread Assemble before final coat? I thought it better to start a new thread than to continue to pile on to the other thread.

Bob,Im with Iggy,if you have the hanging room,you can paint lots of parts with a gun full of paint,Rick

At the moment I'm painting a couple panels on my 314-H along with a dozer blade. After seeing pictures of hanging parts, I've got this stuff hanging in my garage where I'm using Valspar Tractor and Implement (rattle can) to paint. (SWMBO gets a kick out of seeing all of that hanging in the garage. So far. As long as she enjoys it, I'm gold. )

I find I have to apply fairly light coats to avoid sags since the surfaces are vertical. I did two coats yesterday within a couple hours between each and I'm letting it dry until tomorrow for the next coat. At present coverage is not that thorough. I used a black primer and that's not fully covered yet.

Further, the surface finish is not good. I can easily see the tracks where I sprayed. You can see that in the reflection in this picture.

I hope the finish is not going to look like that when I'm done! Will a couple more coats even that out or is this a result of my (lack of) skill painting? Should I lay the parts flat for a final coat to reduce the tendency to sag and run?

I'm on the verge of using a spray gun instead of rattle can. Will I be able to get better results with that? Is this something I should practice until I get better? For the frame and blade on the dozer blade, I'm more concerned about durability than quality of finish. On the tractor body panels, I'd like to achieve a decent finish as well.

Also in Bob's thread:

... I am just thinking about how I am going to best utilized the limited time available to paint once I have activated my acrylic urethane.

What is "pot life" and how long is it? Is that once you add hardener to the paint?

Is acrylic urethane a good choice for this application? My first inclination is to go with Valspar Tractor and Implement paint since I think that would be formulated for durability. But perhaps the restoration series would be a better choice. Their description mentions hardener for the restoration series. Both are described as enamels.

Technically... I should be choosing Toro Red since the tractor is '97 and the plow is '96. Does Toro carry the paint in quarts? Yes - P/N 5340. Thirtysome dollars from what I find on the web. Would that be a good choice? Would I need their hardener or could I get that along with a proper reducer at a local auto paint shop?

Again, I want to state that durability is my first concern and appearance is second.

Thanks all!

[rmaynard 15,715]

First of all, what is a "SWMBO"?

All of the Valspar paints including the Restoration Series, are alkyd enamels. In other words, just plain old oil paint. Though they say that the Restoration Series is more of an automotive paint, as an alkyd, it will fade, chalk, and weather poorly if left out in the elements. This is not my opinion, but actual things said to me by a customer service rep from Valspar.

Acylic Urethanes have UV protectors built in. They are true automotive paints, and designed to resist fading, and chalking. They are a very tough paint that resists scratches and chips.

Pot life is how long the paint can sit in the spray gun before it begins to harden. The Valspar, mixed with a hardener has a pot life of 8 hours. The pot life of the Acrylic Urethane is 2 to 3 hours at 70 degrees, depending on the speed of the activator.

When you are painting lots of items, top, bottom and sides, time can fly by.

As to the lines in the paint, spray cans cannot put down enough paint in one pass to cover sufficiently. That's is why they say to spray several light coats. If you do a heavy coat, it will run. The paint inside a rattle can is about the consistency of milk. That is why it runs if you put on too heavy a coat. Paint from a gun is mixed thicker, and goes on in a much heavier volume with a wider pattern, allowing for a quicker, better coverage in fewer passes.

Bob

[HankB 16]

First of all, what is a "SWMBO"?

...

Acylic Urethanes have UV protectors built in. They are true automotive paints, and designed to resist fading, and chalking. They are a very tough paint that resists scratches and chips.

She Who Must Be Obeyed.

Many thanks for all of the other information! Sounds like I should go to the auto paint store and get an Acrylic Urethane.

[rmaynard 15,715]

Not so fast. Before you run out and buy acrylic urethane paint, there are a couple of things you need to know. First of all, it is expensive. The least expensive product I found was from Kirker (about $100 delivered for 3/4 gallon and activator). All acrylic urethanes use an isocyanate activator. Using the product without proper breathing and eye protection can be extremely hazardous to your health.

All that aside, I think that if you are going to paint with a sprayer, and you are going for the "show queen" look, you are much better off in the long run with a urethane paint. If your intent is to just put a new coat on a worker, use whatever paint you like.

Bob

[HankB 16]

Bob,

Thanks for the additional information.

[Coadster32 793]

Using the product without proper breathing and eye protection can be extremely hazardous to your health.

Yeah, I'd say that's a good bit of information to know beforehand!

[Horse Fanatic 49]

You can get decent results with a spray can if you sand and buff it afterwards. Put some extra coats on so you have some to sand off. Use some 1500 grit wet or dry sand paper and wet sand the orange peel off. Then go over it with rubbing compound and polishing compound.

I did this with spray bomb Valspar resto series and it looks pretty good.

[Ken B 3,164]

My advice is to master the spray can before you try the spray gun. That was the best advice given to my by an old time automotive painter.

As mentioned, automotive type paints are rather expensive and you will only be all the more frustrated if you've wasted good money with poor results.

Just because you use a spray gun that won't guarantee you a show queen paint job.

[HankB 16]

I finished the last rattle can a couple days ago. I was able to get a better surface finish, but not the glass smooth surface I'd want if I were trying for a show queen. But that's not my goal. I want "look nice and hold off the rust."

And I ran out before I finished a complete coat. Having already bought a $10 HF gravity spray gun and filter/regulator, I drove to my not-so-local Farm and Fleet and got a couple quarts of IH Red, hardener and odorless thinner. Being the cheap bastage that I am, I went with Tractor and Implement rather than Restoration Series. (It was on sale, to boot! )

Today I mixed up about 1/3 qt of paint with the prescribed amount of hardener and about half the recommended thinner. I was surprised by how thick the paint looked. The rattle can looks a lot thinner as it is sprayed. I suppose that is required by the lower atomizing pressure available in the rattle can.

After the 1/2 hour wait time, I started to spray. Initially I think I was getting too-light coverage. I increased fluid flow and slowed my movement and got a heavier coat. That seemed to result in a smoother finish. It's still not glass smooth, but it is just fine for my needs. I sprayed everything and still had paint left, so I went back and applied a second coat (about an hour later) to some of the pieces. Except for a few spots that I missed, I seem to get pretty good coverage too.

I also like that I can make the spray pattern horizontal or vertical to better match the shape I'm painting.

I can't argue the wisdom of learning with a rattle can. It will enforce habits such as good surface prep. I found it easier to get good results with the spray gun. I'm sure with practice I'll do better yet. The other thing about the spray gun is that there is more capacity to adjust application. I suppose that implies further capacity to screw it up, but I prefer to think of it as better ability to tailor to the desired results.

One thing I probably should have done is hung on to that last rattle can to use for touch ups.

Thanks all for the tips and suggestions that helped get me off to a decent start.

[Coadster32 793]

:D of the paint job.

[HankB 16]

of the paint job.

Had to let the paint dry enough to handle that stuff!

When I get it back together I'll even post pictures of the awful match between IH Red and faded Toro Red. I'm sure it will be spectacular.

It will probably be a while before I put the plow back together. Some of that still needs painting and I want to let it dry as long as possible since there are parts that slide against each other. (I suppose the paint on the surfaces where the blade rotates won't last past the first time I plow snow anyway.) The springs will take a bit as it's particularly difficult to get paint between the coils.

[HankB 16]

Here's the final result. It's obvious, but not as bad as I had thought it would be. While doing the work, I found that the bolts that are supposed to hold the engine to the left side of the frame were loose. (Not any more.) And I had clear access to the drive belt which was nice and shiny. So I replaced it.

And I found a spot on the seat/fender pan that is rusty.

Well, I'll have another project. But if I do that, I'll do the hood and any other incidentals.

The other question that remains is if I should get Toro Red or stick with IH Red.

So... Maybe I'll mow the lawn today. :D

[rmaynard 15,715]

Don't get no green on the nice new red

Bob

[rickv1957 72]

I like the toro new red really nice!,Rick