8 speed vs 4 speed

[mavfreak 11]

I am buying an 8 speed trans to relace my 4 speed. I was kinda wondering what the diffarence is between the two. Is the 8 speed low gear the same as the 4 speed or is the high gear higher? I am treplacing it because the reverse gear is going in the 4 speed. and the input shaft is very lose (about 1/2" in and out play). Is that to much play? Also and I think this was covered in other posts what kinda lube should be used and does anyone like royal purpel or locus?

[hotrodmerc 1]

The 8 speed is the same as the 4 speed in high range. When you shift it to low range you have more torque available and quite a low ground speed. The low range is great for pulling a load up a hill, running a blower on the front, and plowing a garden. You will use high range most of the time but the lower range makes a good tractor that much more versatile.

[Duff 206]

1st gear in low range is something like a "corner gear" in a truck. If you are plowing your garden, you can tie off the steering wheel, get off the tractor (if the seat safety switch is disabled), go get a cup of coffee, drink it and read the paper, then go back out and turn the tractor around for another pass....all while pulling a multiple share plow and a set of spring tooth harrows behind that.... through clay. As long as you can get traction, the set up is virtually unstoppable!

(Obviously, I'm exaggerating a bit here!)

Duff

EDIT: Heath, on a serious note, though - if you're not used to the 8-speed tranny, be absolutely sure you are at a complete standstill with the clutch in and everything stopped before moving between high and low range! It is very easy to bend the shifter fork in the range selector, and changing it requires splitting the tranny case. :clap:

[mavfreak 11]

I was hopping to get more ground speed out of it. I plow two friends houses here in town I could walk almost as fast as this tractor moves in 3rd gear. has anyone played with pully size on input side of trans to get alittler more speed?

Is there a way to check for a bent fork while trans is off tractor? I don't want to go buy this 8 speed put it on my tractor only to find out someone else bent it before I got my hands on it.

But yes the slower speed to blow snow and till or plow garden yes I want that to. I guess I just want it all B)

[kpinnc 12,418]

Yes, some folks have changed pulley size to affect ground speed. Just remember that you'll be trading available torque for speed, so you might want to stay away from going too small with the input shaft pulley. In addition, if you go too small with the pulley, it will slip more under load, and probably require another idler back there to make the belt have more contact with the pulley surface.

Kevin

[mavfreak 11]

I hadn't really thought of slippage. I did how ever think of after I posted last post is that would change belt lenth which open another problem and expence. I think I'll just leave pully alone and pack a lunch the next time i need to drive mile down the road. which will probly be tonght. I love snow but I am getting tired of it!

[rickv1957 72]

Have fun in that snow! hopefully over soon!,Rick

[Duvall 0]

I hadn't really thought of slippage. I did how ever think of after I posted last post is that would change belt lenth which open another problem and expence. I think I'll just leave pully alone and pack a lunch the next time i need to drive mile down the road. which will probly be tonght. I love snow but I am getting tired of it!

I have a 2 or 2 1/2" pulley on the rear of my 416 with a 5 1/4" hydro pulley on the engine.

I drive back and forth to my mothers house to cut her grass. The commute time is less than half of what it was.

The belt is a different size, but it was not too hard to figure out. I can tell you that it does not slip. Even when pushing heavy wet snow with wheel weights and loaded tires.

I use the low 3 and high 1 for mowing, still plenty slow on the low side.

[mavfreak 11]

really? and whats 1st low still as slow and powerful as before? Now I'm thinking again not good? B)

[Docwheelhorse 2,682]

HI--figured I would jump in and mention that the brake assembly and location is slightly different on a 4 speed versus an 8 speed and some fabrication will have to be done to get the brake to work after you make the swap.

Tony

[hotrodmerc 1]

HI--figured I would jump in and mention that the brake assembly and location is slightly different on a 4 speed versus an 8 speed and some fabrication will have to be done to get the brake to work after you make the swap.

Tony

You are correct. I swapped my 552 from a 4 to an 8 speed. Just a slight bit of fabrication but well worth it.

[mavfreak 11]

no problem on fab'ing up something. I was going to go pick up trans today but weather is putting a halt to that. maybe next week.

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[Nick 13]

Might have been mentioned but the 10" rims from the commando will not fit on the 8 speed. Good time to step up to 12" anyway.

[mavfreak 11]

Why is that?

[Rollerman 290]

Might have been mentioned but the 10" rims from the commando will not fit on the 8 speed. Good time to step up to 12" anyway

What is the bolt patern on your Commando?

Does it match the bigger 5 lug Horses with 12" rear rims?

If it is the standard 5 lug the sky is the limit & almost any combination will work.

The hubs & axles on your Comando are probably 1" diameter.

If you find a light duty 4 pinion 8 speed with 1" axles everything should go back to gether fairly easy.

If your 8 speed has the 1 1/8" axles your going to have to modify your Commando's hubs if you need to keep them, or go with the standard 12" rear rims & 5 bolt pattern

Make sense? B)

[mavfreak 11]

The new 8 speed has 1" shafts I made sure of it and as far as I know the bolt pattern is the same. I'll be using my hubs anyway.

[mavfreak 11]

Ok I found out its the lenth of the axles. I give up. Anyone want to buy an 8 speed transmission

[Rollerman 290]

Why not swap the axles....or go with the taller 12" wheel/tire combo.

[mavfreak 11]

already out of money. Seems that I did all the research but one thing, wheels. Yes I would like to go with the 12" wheels but I have 2 brand new ag tires sitting here. size 20 10 8. I think i will just try to figure out why the revears gear is jumping out. And why I have so much play in the input pully. In other words I'm going to fix my 4 speed. I already talked to the guy who I bought trans from and I am going to take it back and he is looking to see if he has any 4 speeds there and see if I can use on of those for parts or if there in better shape than mine.

Sorry about wasting everyones time here and thank you for all the input before i got to far into this.

[Rollerman 290]

Heath I'm not 100% certain, but I think the 4 speed trans in your Commando would have the later style axles with the snap ring retainers just like the later 8 speeds

It's really simple to open up a trans case, pull the axle/diff assembly & have a look.

Drain the oil, pull the rear hitch assembly off, hubs, brake drum, driven pulley, & all but two of the bolts holding the cases together.

Then set it on end with the shallow side of the trans case down....pull the remaning hardware & start working the trans case halfs apart.

You may be able to swap the longer axles/diff that you need into the 8 speeds trans or into the longer axles into the 8 speeds diff itself.

Worst case scenerio...your out the gear lube you drained & the gasket between the trase case halfs breaks.

I think your 20" tall ags will look great on your Commando & I'm sure there is a solution useing the right combination of parts to make it work. B)

[Nick 13]

If that 8 speed is in good condition I wouldn't give up on the swap altogether. As rollerman mentioned changing the axles might be an option. Maybe there are some cheap 10" rims with the right offset out there.

There is another option but it takes a bit of cutting and welding. You could find a donor set of 5 lug rims and cut the centers out and cut the center out of your rims. The 12" centers can be welded back into your rims giving the offset you want. I did this because at the time i wanted to use 20-8-10 tires on my lawn ranger and also to widen it for more stability.

[mavfreak 11]

I don't know what i'm going to do. I'm already going to have to tear down one trans. so I don't know. again thanks everyone

[mavfreak 11]

Ok I found a set of wheels from the same person I am geting trans from. He called me and said he has a set of wheels with good tread he'll throw in for a small price. As far as the tires go I will see if they fit my other tractor('91 mtd 18hp 46" deck) Which i think they will I just can't get to it right now cause of about a 4' snow drift in front of shed. But things are looking better now.

[Nick 13]

Good to hear its turning out ok. Im sure you will like the 8 speed.

[mavfreak 11]

i picked up my 8 speed last night. maybe if I get some time I'll try to get it in and give it a try