Advice Needed - Homebrew Garden Cart....??

[Crow Horse 8]

I have a garden cart that I purchased from Home Depot a couple of years ago that I tow around with my B-80. It's current assignment is a wood hauler and because of the loads and terrain that I must carry & negotiate, I've had to upgrade a number of items. In it's original state, it's rated at 1000 pounds. Don't believe that for a moment. All the wheels cracked at the hub at one time or another forcing me to weld them back together. I then upgraded to lawn tractor tires & rims and modified the spindles to accept them. It solved one problem but just moved the weak link to another point. The tie rod and wheel support then weakened and eventually bent up. It appeared that I was just polishing a turd, so I made another big upgrade.

I fitted lawn tractor front axles (with the same tires - 15-6-6) and mounted them so that original design movement was retained. It doesn't appear that I'll be breaking anything soon but I'm not sure at this point which way to go. I knew I needed to address fabbing a "suspension" and was looking into Kart or ATV/snowmobile shocks (coil type), but I was thinking about using small standard shocks as an option. My gut says this won't work as well as the coil overs.

I'll post some pics tomorrow of this home brew cart so you can get a better idea as to what I'm talking about.

When the suspension is finalized, I'll then look into 4 wheel steering for it (it should be pretty easy to do). That should be helpful when I thread my way in the woods to retrieve the cut rounds.....

Any ideas will be entertained.......

[KB9LOR 4]

I can't wait to see it, I have been contemplating the very same thing, "How to make my cart WH tough", I will be following this with very much interest!

[Crow Horse 8]

Here's a couple of quick pics. Please pardon the quality of them.....

Being that I'm doing this on a shoestring budget, some items that I used weren't my first choice, but I had them on hand. The axle assemblies I found on E-Bay for cheap but the shipping was about 4x what I paid for the axles...... If you have a garden/lawn tractor bone yard close by then you might be able to do this cheaper than I did.....

Attached Image

[Crow Horse 8]

Side view ..........

Attached Image

[Crow Horse 8]

Front view.....

Attached Image

[TT-(Moderator) 1,145]

Perhaps transverse mounted leaf springs (golf cart or small utility trailer sized) mounted behind the axles and attached to the underside of the floor/frame? The spring eyes could be connected to the outer ends of the axle beams with links or "shackles" of some sort.

[Crow Horse 8]

This is pretty much max articulation. The rear wheel is 11 inches off the ground while the other 3 are still planted.....

Attached Image

[Sarge 3,464]

C'mon Crow, this should be easy - go look under the Sami and just think smaller. My 2-wheel lawn trailer/cart/whatever just uses Toyota front axle spindles welded to heavy wall well pipe . Homemade perches, shackles ect and it rides pretty well. For a front steer/4 wheel cart you could use the spindles you have and just notch them into a piece of pipe then weld them up solid . Make a center pivot pin point for the rear facing end of the tongue and use that to steer the tie rods to the front wheels. Same basic setup as a grain cart, very simple and pretty effective. It would even work with leaf springs up front, built one like that years ago but don't have a pic.

Sarge

[Crow Horse 8]

Perhaps transverse mounted leaf springs (golf cart or small utility trailer sized) mounted behind the axles and attached to the underside of the floor/frame? The spring eyes could be connected to the outer ends of the axle beams with links or "shackles" of some sort.

Interesting..... I just searched E-Bay for what might be available, but nothing was cheap enough to fit my budget..... I'll keep looking though...

So far, the front runner is the coil over ATV/kart shocks that are replacements for the Chinese ATV's. For maybe $40-$60 I could get all 4, then fab up brackets to mount them. I'm thinking the 9 3/4" - 11" overall length shocks would work mounted on an angle. The shock travel is usually 2"-3", so I'm aware that they will limit articulation a bit but I don't think that will be an issue for my use..........

[Crow Horse 8]

C'mon Crow, this should be easy - go look under the Sami and just think smaller. My 2-wheel lawn trailer/cart/whatever just uses Toyota front axle spindles welded to heavy wall well pipe . Homemade perches, shackles ect and it rides pretty well. For a front steer/4 wheel cart you could use the spindles you have and just notch them into a piece of pipe then weld them up solid . Make a center pivot pin point for the rear facing end of the tongue and use that to steer the tie rods to the front wheels. Same basic setup as a grain cart, very simple and pretty effective. It would even work with leaf springs up front, built one like that years ago but don't have a pic.

Sarge

Yep, a lot smaller! Trying to get this cart complete within budget is the most difficult part as well as minimize down time. I use this thing almost daily and would be lost without it's use......

Once the suspension is squared away, the easiest part I think will be to make it 4 wheel steering. I believe it will only take one long home brew tie rod and bracket to make it work. Just connect the front & rear tie rods on a diagonal (at least that's the plan).....

[Sarge 3,464]

To make a 4-wheel steer unit you would have to position a center point pivot halfway between the two axles and place the rear axle's tie rods ahead of the rear axle. Basically, all tie rods would be in the area between the axles. It does make a nice turning radius and will easily follow you in tight quarters. Shop around, used front quad struts are cheap if you can find them.

Sarge

[Don1977 604]

Here is one I built last spring. I though I might have to put stops on the front axle

to keep wheels from hitting the bed but haven't needed them. The bed is fixed to the rear axle and the front pivots on the 2" pipe that is fixed to the rear axle. It's 7' long and 38" wide. Had a load of brush on it up higher than my head a month ago but my camera battery was dead.

http://www.wheelhorseforum.com/index.php?showtopic=12481

[d180man 5]

Hi very nice job! we got one from tsc and it is junk ties go flat and not made that good! but like yours looks nice! :wwp:

[Duff 206]

Crow - like what you're doing and I'm finding this thread very instructive. Also good to see you back on the forum - hadn't heard from you in a while!

Duff :thumbs:

[Crow Horse 8]

Nice job Don!

Thanks Duff. I've been busy either cutting firewood, hauling it out of the woods or repairing/upgrading this cart.

Sarge, You mentioned a center pivot point, but wouldn't another steering rod mounted to the tie rod mount points on a diagonal work as well. I have the tie rods mounted between the axles now.....

[rickv1957 72]

Nice job on your cart!,looks heavy duty,Rick

[dodge78 90]

Why couldn't you use one of these on each axel? Then use a rag joint or a steering column shaft out of a truck for some flexability?

[Sarge 3,464]

Not sure what you mean on the diagonal part Crow....

I was referring to the tongue section, say if the tongue is 4' long, then extend it past the front axle 6" to the rear. Make a pivot point in the center of the tongue's tip behind the axle, say a piece of flat stock welded to the end of the tonge appx 3" wide. Make 3 holes, one each for the front axle's tie rods and one for the rear steering. Add another piece of flat steel and make it's pivot in the center of the trailer's bed. At the rearward end of that flat stock, make another plate for the rear tie rods to bolt on . With this center steer link in place, with one pivoting at the end of the tongue and the other controlling the rear steer the rear wheels will turn opposite the front wheels. Wish I had a way to draw all this out.

Btw, a single axle cart will do much more and doesn't care about terrain changes. My own cart here will handle 2 tons and can still be pulled by a garden tractor.

I've had enough weight in this thing that it broke the last axle, the new one now will carry way more than the box could ever hold.

Sarge

[Crow Horse 8]

Dodge, that would work but would require a lot more fabing and material.......

Sarge, tomorrow I'll take some pics of the belly and draw in what I have in mind.....

The problem I would have with a single axle cart/trailer is negotiating the hills. Even with the cart I have it sometimes gets dicey going up them. The front wheels get a little sky happy. I'll have to snap some pics of the trails I travel........

[418a 0]

Crow,Look in the junk yards too, Alot of stuff is there for the pickin.My first one was an old pop-up camper, That I use everyday,Just cut off the tougue and fab a hitch,gut the camper or what was left,it also dumps!!!!! The other is a 4 wheel cart that was a old greenhouse wagon found an old JD bed and put that on it.Very heavy though,need the 520 to pull her around.Just keep your eyes open theres alot of cheap cheap ways to get a better cart than you would pay for one that will only last a little while in stores.Good luck. Brian

[Crow Horse 8]

Here's a pic of the belly and the proposed linkage in yellow for the rear steering....

Attached Image (Click thumbnail to expand)

[Sarge 3,464]

The only way a single diagonal link will work would be to add a new pair of arms to the spindles and much longer to make the geometry work. Also, might want to spend some time making a bracket to either latch into the front tach-a-matic or the center one for additional weight to stabilize the machine. Front wheel weights help a lot too but they are pretty hard to find .

That 2-wheel of mine is pretty closely balanced and rides better than expected when it's fully loaded. It's only real downfall I can see is the added weight to the rear axle when it's heavily loaded down, as well as side thrust against the rear axles on the tractor.

Sarge

[Crow Horse 8]

Sarge, do you mean that the angle of the rod must have a greater angle? I could weld on tabs to the existing arms to accomodate another rod.....

[Sarge 3,464]

Yes, in a straight line the rod should be nearly 90* to the rods to be effective.

Sarge

[Crow Horse 8]

Is this close to what you mean? Have I got it bass ackwards?

Attached Image (Click thumbnail to expand)