Mickwhitt 4,975 #1 Posted January 23 Hi all. Over here in the UK we have had a rash of murders committed by young kids on young kids. We are waiting for the sentencing of a 19 year old who stabbed 13 people last year when he was three days short of being 18. 11 of those people were girls under ten years old. Three of them died, the youngest was six. He had also made ricin poison at home and had an Al Quaida manual on his computer. He said he was glad he had killed the girls. The judge cannot sentence the offender to life, because he was under 18 when he did the murders. In court this morning he screamed at the judge and had to be forcibly removed twice. He has no mental health problems and admitted everything as well as being on camera doing it. He was born in Britain from parents who came in as immigrants from a violent country. We removed the death penalty decades ago so that's not an option, although I feel if the public voted on it rather than parliament it would be reintroduced. Even though I know it is not a deterrent, it seems a fitting way to deal with the very worst criminals. I just can't see how the stem the rising tide of young people who simply have no regard for life. I'm not asking for a political debate but I'm struggling to understand how a justice system can deal with the kind of thing we are experiencing. Mick 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ri702bill 8,926 #2 Posted January 23 35 minutes ago, Mickwhitt said: We removed the death penalty decades ago so that's not an option, although I feel if the public voted on it rather than parliament it would be reintroduced Mick - here in the US, most States, but not all, abolished the death penalty years ago. Almost all that have it require guidelines in using it for only the most hienous of crimes. of crimes. The short version - it does not get used much... it is still a controversial subject here... 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
davem1111 2,091 #3 Posted January 23 1 hour ago, Mickwhitt said: [...] stabbed 13 people last year when he was three days short of being 18. [...] He has no mental health problems and admitted everything as well as being on camera doing it. [...] Okay, I personally would question the credentials, methods, and *sanity* of the people evaluating his mental health state and came to the conclusion that he had no mental health problems after doing all that. WTH? 4 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ed Kennell 40,316 #4 Posted January 23 9 minutes ago, davem1111 said: Okay, I personally would question the credentials, methods, and *sanity* of the people evaluating his mental health state and came to the conclusion that he had no mental health problems after doing all that. WTH? It is nearly impossible to stop these mass murderers before they commit the crimes. If only they would take their own lives instead. The problem with the death penalty, even if it is legal, it is usually decades before it is carried out. 4 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SylvanLakeWH 27,260 #5 Posted January 23 As you may have noticed, we haven't exactly figured this problem out on this side of the pond either... Throughout history, there is always a segment of all societies that simply are a danger to themselves and/or others... cost of a civilized society is appropriate facilities for them... and the resolve to use them... ranging from mental health to super max prisons... 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mickwhitt 4,975 #6 Posted January 23 The death penalty is only carried out after years on death row because if the endless appeals based on faulty law. I acknowledge that some miscarriages of justice could happen. But in cases like this where the offender was caught standing over the six year old victim having stabbed her 122 times and it is beyond any doubt that he did it there should be no delay, no appeal, no chance of release. This is as open and shut as can be, obviously the lad is not normal. But he knew exactly what he was doing and that it was wrong, but he didn't care. We excuse so much these days by saying offenders have problems, if a dog savages a person it is humanely destroyed. It should be the same for a human who commits such horrendous violence. This kid will go to jail and possibly end up dead at a fellow inmates hands or mentally ill because he will never be released. Surely it would be better to take unpalatable action now and protect him from the inevitable fate. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mickwhitt 4,975 #7 Posted January 23 Our prisons are overflowing and we have many proven and horrific murderers on whole life sentences. In this age of forensic certainty and cctv records of people committing these crimes we should perhaps bite the bullet and finally draw a line in the sand. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Handy Don 13,272 #8 Posted January 23 (edited) I, too, have trouble with these terrible things perpetrated by individuals whose value systems are so, so divergent from mine and the societal values of our two countries. Yet, I’ve come to the personal conclusion that the society that enforces certain values must either: a) own sequestering those who will not adhere to the set values, or b) reexamine the values being enforced. Edited January 23 by Handy Don 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lynnmor 7,549 #9 Posted January 23 Fair trial: https://clip.cafe/silverado-1985/were-gonna-give-a-fair-trial-s1/ Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mickwhitt 4,975 #10 Posted January 24 He got 52 years in prison. So he will be 69 before he can apply for parole. Even then he won't be granted his freedom based on the evil acts he carried out. Keeping him away from the public protects them physically from him. But these days prison is no more secure than a normal home, because inmates are allowed connections to the world. The Internet and mobile phones allow prisoners to keep in touch, news platforms perpetuate their presence by publishing one story or another to sell papers. Prisoners are even allowed to have relationships and get married. For me they should cease to exist in public consciousness once they are incarcerated. Erase them from civil society and cut off the oxygen of publicity which they can use to their own ends... Ian Brady, Charles Bronson, the Kray twins, Levi Bellfield, the list goes on. They all traded on their notoriety by making the headlines even from inside. If someone chooses not to follow the rules of civil society they should no longer receive its benefits or privileges. Nor should they receive its protection, living outside the law means just that; not bound by it so not protected by it. I'm ranting because I'm angry, upset, clueless as to how our society has found itself here. This kid was on the radar, had been referred to programs and the authorities several times. He was known to carry knives, had made threats to kill and yet he was never dealt with for fear of offending his ethnic sensibilities or those of the woke generation who won't hear a bad word said about bad people. Great God in heaven how has this happened, and where will it go unless we do something radical and effective? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wayne0 869 #11 Posted January 24 We'll see how things go here, now that we have a new sheriff in town. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lynnmor 7,549 #12 Posted January 24 9 minutes ago, Wayne0 said: We'll see how things go here, now that we have a new sheriff in town. Trouble is the worthless are pushing back as hard as ever. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites