312 front scoop pipe dream

[b00mhower 14]

Hello all, long time listener first time caller 

 

Long story short my main squeeze, 312-8 with the Magnum 12, is back on full duty rotation after a brief on account of a proper compact tractor. Sadly the other tractor went off to the great blue yonder so now it's me and Lil Red again. 

 

Up until now I've used it mainly for the push blade and pulling things it really ought not be pulling but I recently welded up a sleeve hitch clevis and installed a cable kit so I could plow in my garden.

 

This scenario brings me to my next, I would like to leave the sleeve hitch attached to my lift lever full time, I would also like a front blade/scoop.

 

Now the idea. 

A) attach my existing plow frame, but operate via linear actuator, small hydro cylinder (power steering pump set up), or belly mounted winch

 

B) attach my existing plow frame but modify blade to accommodate an auxiliary scoop (don't love seeing as how I wouldn't have a dump function this route)

 

C) build a subframe mounted to the front and mid tach a matic and build a "not a loader but not a scoop". The idea would be power lift and lower and power dump and curl but not on the level of a full blown garden tractor loader. 

 

I'm not willing to fork over $2k to Johnny Bucket for their system and I've got more time than money. Expectations are low performance wise but if I can move a few yards of loose dirt and maybe a few yards of dumped gravel without a wheelbarrow I'd be a happy camper.

 

Any input would be appreciated. Notably option C) and the potential 1-200lb load cantilevered out between the mid and front mounts 

 

Thanks all!

 

 

[953 nut 55,394]

For a light duty small scoop you could fabricate a scoop that attaches where the mule drive mounts as a pivot point. A sturdy rod (3/4" pipe) from the rock shaft running forward to the bottom rear of the bucket would tilt the bucket up to transport the load. That should accommodate a 100 pound load with no problem.

[ebinmaine 67,766]

 

 

Sounds like you've done some research and have some decent ideas floating around already.

100 to 200 lb capacity should be fairly easy to come up with.

You could counterweight the rear by fluid filling tires if you needed to.

 

Option B Could be made to have a dump function using your existing plow and building sides onto it with a bottom of course. 

Remember that the plow blades have two rods which could be used as pivot positions.

You could also make it so that the bottom would split AWAY from the plow blade instead of needing to dump forward.

 

 

[oliver2-44 9,787]

I've been clocting pictures about various types of scoops.

As you  can see they have been adapeted to front plows and to rear sleeve and 3 point hitches.

 The "Scoop Tote" was manufactured and sold in the 70's i think.  

 

 

 

 

 

867a0222dc4cdf3748a329075cb1d8c4-scoop-tote.pdf

 

 

867a0222dc4cdf3748a329075cb1d8c4-scoop-tote.pdf

Edited November 11 by oliver2-44

[b00mhower 14]

4 hours ago, 953 nut said:

For a light duty small scoop you could fabricate a scoop that attaches where the mule drive mounts as a pivot point. A sturdy rod (3/4" pipe) from the rock shaft running forward to the bottom rear of the bucket would tilt the bucket up to transport the load. That should accommodate a 100 pound load with no problem.

I had considered that route but that front mount is fairly anemic for any kind of dynamic load. That's where my front and mid mount frame idea came into play, attach the subframe and have my pivot just forward of the front mount 

[b00mhower 14]

2 hours ago, ebinmaine said:

 

 

Sounds like you've done some research and have some decent ideas floating around already.

100 to 200 lb capacity should be fairly easy to come up with.

You could counterweight the rear by fluid filling tires if you needed to.

 

Option B Could be made to have a dump function using your existing plow and building sides onto it with a bottom of course. 

Remember that the plow blades have two rods which could be used as pivot positions.

You could also make it so that the bottom would split AWAY from the plow blade instead of needing to dump forward.

 

 

Counterweight is already in place. Considered casting some concrete wheel weights as well as the loaded and chained tires, or duals but that's a different can of worms. 

 

I did play around with the kind of bucket you mention as I've seen them on skid steers but for a light duty bucket I didn't want to get too far out there with the engineering for 100 some pounds lol

 

 

[b00mhower 14]

3 minutes ago, oliver2-44 said:

I've been clocting pictures about various types of scoops.

As you  can see they have been adapeted to front plows and to rear sleeve and 3 point hitches.

 The "Scoop Tote" was manufactured and sold in the 70's i think.  

 

 

 

 

 

867a0222dc4cdf3748a329075cb1d8c4-scoop-tote.pdf 2.58 MB · 1 download

 

file:///E:/Jim%20Guenther/Documents/Garden%20Tractors/wheelhorse/Scoop%20tote%20-%20Implements%20and%20Attachments%20-%20RedSquare%20Wheel%20Horse%20Forum.mhtml

 

 

867a0222dc4cdf3748a329075cb1d8c4-scoop-tote.pdf 2.58 MB · 0 downloads

Just saved all of those for some inspiration. I've been down the rear scoop road before with larger 3 point tractors and never was all that pleased with them, couldn't seem to find the right combination of speed and traction to scoop much of anything in reverse 

[oliver2-44 9,787]

1 minute ago, b00mhower said:

Just saved all of those for some inspiration. I've been down the rear scoop road before with larger 3 point tractors and never was all that pleased with them, couldn't seem to find the right combination of speed and traction to scoop much of anything in reverse 

 

Yes, I like the idea of adding a scoop buck to an existing dozer blade. have the work is already done and making it open with a lever and rope keeps it simple.

[b00mhower 14]

58 minutes ago, oliver2-44 said:

 

Yes, I like the idea of adding a scoop buck to an existing dozer blade. have the work is already done and making it open with a lever and rope keeps it simple.

I agree. My only reservation is lift height, just eyeballing it I could get maybe 6" of lift until I hit the front axle, considered getting larger dia tri ribs for the fronts for a little extra height but I may just do my proof of concept and see what happens 

[ebinmaine 67,766]

6 hours ago, b00mhower said:

I agree. My only reservation is lift height, just eyeballing it I could get maybe 6" of lift until I hit the front axle, considered getting larger dia tri ribs for the fronts for a little extra height but I may just do my proof of concept and see what happens 

 

Our acreage here is ROUGH mountain side land. We live on a boulder waste field. 

Not much is super steep but near to all of it is up down left right twist turn hard to keep ahold of. 

 

I have a C160 that I keep a Mackissic chipper shredder on most all year. 

I really needed the extra height on the front so I could use the machine on the whole property.  

 

I put trailer hubs and 12" wheels out front. 6/12 AGs. 

It went from a 16" tall tire to a 22".

That supposed 3" is more because the actual measurement of the 16 was less and the actual measurement of the 22" is all of that.  

I gained a good strong 5" + out at the chipper bottom.  

 

Your machine would benefit from that.  

 

 

 

[b00mhower 14]

13 minutes ago, ebinmaine said:

 

Our acreage here is ROUGH mountain side land. We live on a boulder waste field. 

Not much is super steep but near to all of it is up down left right twist turn hard to keep ahold of. 

 

I have a C160 that I keep a Mackissic chipper shredder on most all year. 

I really needed the extra height on the front so I could use the machine on the whole property.  

 

I put trailer hubs and 12" wheels out front. 6/12 AGs. 

It went from a 16" tall tire to a 22".

That supposed 3" is more because the actual measurement of the 16 was less and the actual measurement of the 22" is all of that.  

I gained a good strong 5" + out at the chipper bottom.  

 

Your machine would benefit from that.  

 

 

 

Interesting! I like the sound of gaining 5" of travel in the front, is the rear at stock height? If so how does the tractor look as far as rake? I've heard of swapping out for trailer hubs before but haven't looked into it much myself 

[ebinmaine 67,766]

14 minutes ago, b00mhower said:

Interesting! I like the sound of gaining 5" of travel in the front, is the rear at stock height? If so how does the tractor look as far as rake? I've heard of swapping out for trailer hubs before but haven't looked into it much myself 

 

 

Here's a couple videos of that tractor by itself and with some of our others so you can see a size and shape comparison. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[b00mhower 14]

5 minutes ago, ebinmaine said:

 

 

Here's a couple videos of that tractor by itself and with some of our others so you can see a size and shape comparison. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

That is a slick looking fleet of rigs you got there! I appreciate the links that really puts the talk front tires in better perspective. I'll have to look further into the trailer hubs, luckily I work for an OPE dealer so I should be able to get tires pretty decently affordable 

[ebinmaine 67,766]

I can get you pics of the parts needed for the trailer hub swap tomorrow if ya like.  

[b00mhower 14]

Just now, ebinmaine said:

I can get you pics of the parts needed for the trailer hub swap tomorrow if ya like.  

If you're willing I'd greatly appreciate it. Currently seems fairly straightforward but I've been bit by that thinking before lol

[ebinmaine 67,766]

2 minutes ago, b00mhower said:

If you're willing I'd greatly appreciate it. Currently seems fairly straightforward but I've been bit by that thinking before lol

 

It really is as simple as you think.  

[b00mhower 14]

4 minutes ago, ebinmaine said:

 

It really is as simple as you think.  

Appears that I could sleeve my existing spindles to get them to 1", slide on the trailer hubs, then cotter pin and washer to hold it all together?

[wallfish 17,023]

6 minutes ago, b00mhower said:

Appears that I could sleeve my existing spindles to get them to 1", slide on the trailer hubs, then cotter pin and washer to hold it all together?

That's how I have done them except for drilling a hole and tapping threads into the end of the spindles to keep those bearings tight instead of cotter pins

 

I've been toying with the idea of a blade to a bucket for a while but never seem to get around to it. Don't really need it anymore and even sold my loader hoe tractor to EB but building stuff is the fun part.

Edited November 12 by wallfish

[b00mhower 14]

1 minute ago, wallfish said:

That's how I have done them except for drilling a hole and tapping threads into the end of the spindles to keep those bearings tight instead of cotter pins

Guess you were right it really is that straightforward. Thank you!

[wallfish 17,023]

EB modified some 1" spindles to fit over the original spindles.

These I did with DOM tube to trailer hubs like you wrote. 6-12 rims and tires

That's my friend Gary on it

Always nice to see guys building their own stuff!

 

[ebinmaine 67,766]

14 minutes ago, b00mhower said:

Appears that I could sleeve my existing spindles to get them to 1", slide on the trailer hubs, then cotter pin and washer to hold it all together?

 

I used trailer hub & stub axles. 

Had someone drill them at .750. 

Used JB Weld to hold the trailer stub onto the Wheelhorse spindle. 

 

Works slick.  

 

 

[ebinmaine 67,766]

Here's a couple pics from a few weeks ago. 

 

 

 

 

 

[wallfish 17,023]

1 minute ago, ebinmaine said:

Here's a couple pics from a few weeks ago. 

Those do look nice but you should weld those Eric. I like the look of those hubs too

[b00mhower 14]

6 minutes ago, ebinmaine said:

Here's a couple pics from a few weeks ago. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

9 minutes ago, wallfish said:

EB modified some 1" spindles to fit over the original spindles.

These I did with DOM tube to trailer hubs like you wrote. 6-12 rims and tires

That's my friend Gary on it

Always nice to see guys building their own stuff!

 

Wall:  I'll have to see if I can find something to match up nicely. Cursory glance at McMaster shows 3/4 ID means 1 1/8 OD, I'll have to see what size hubs I can get or sweet talk my buddy up the road to use his little Logan lathe 

 

EB: I see what you're saying with stub axles now, seems like that'd be just as easy as sleeving my original spindles possibly stronger since there's one less part involved 

Edited November 12 by b00mhower

[ebinmaine 67,766]

10 minutes ago, wallfish said:

Those do look nice but you should weld those Eric. I like the look of those hubs too

I agree. 

These have been on like that for several years with LOTS of use. 

No signs of looseosity. 

 

Might toss a  couple 6011 tacks on there.