Testing lock nuts

[bc_gold 71]

 

[ebinmaine 67,401]

Interesting video. I watched it earlier today.  

 

It IS misleading though. 

 

The nuts and bolts were NOT tested at proper torque.  

[cleat 5,915]

I also use them for different purposes.

I use lockwashers for nuts/bolts that are torqued tight.

I use Nylock nuts when I want the fasteners not so tight as in a linkage where things need to move.

Also Nylock nuts are useful for retaining springs where the spring can't be pinched tight.

 

[ri702bill 8,311]

3 hours ago, ebinmaine said:

Interesting video. I watched it earlier today.  

 

It IS misleading though. 

 

The nuts and bolts were NOT tested at proper torque.  

 

Good observation... If you re-use a Nylock, it does not grip the bolt as tightly....

Best practice would be the use of an anerobic sealant like Loctite??? ALL our critical assemblies of Automated Production Equipment got the "Service Removable" blue or purple - with the matching primer.

Curious if he set the Recip saw to 2 or 3 how ugly it got...

[ebinmaine 67,401]

6 hours ago, cleat said:

I also use them for different purposes.

I use lockwashers for nuts/bolts that are torqued tight.

I use Nylock nuts when I want the fasteners not so tight as in a linkage where things need to move.

Also Nylock nuts are useful for retaining springs where the spring can't be pinched tight.

 

 

I use nyloc nuts for most things. 

If I need a lock washer I usually use a Star type. 

 

We have very rough twisty hilly terrain. 

I've assembled tractors and implements with the original WH bolts and modern cheap Gr 5 like from a TSC or HD. 

We've had bolts break off. 

 

We've also had the experience of the lock washer cracking or breaking right out. 

 

That's why I switched over a few years ago to using almost exclusively GR 8 hardware. 

Pricing is similar. Zinc coated for corrosion resistance. 

Far superior strength for holding larger torque preloads. 

 

We switched to nyloc nuts then too. 

 

Add a little length to the bolt to compensate for the wider nut and flat washer ... torque away.  

[peter lena 8,606]

 @bc.gold  notice in your testing that there is no SLIDE  ENHANCEMENT SUPPORT, IN THE SIDE AREAS ?  think a teflon / bronze equalizer  at the bolt  to side contact area  would dramatically  improve all the violent side  to side play . basically a  slide block to eliminate  buzzing , front  to back motion , is assured , empty side to side play , is the  cause / reason for consistent failure . often see that in a similar failure point , have to control the incremental start / stop , side to side empty  point . pete  

[bc_gold 71]

23 hours ago, peter lena said:

 @bc.gold  notice in your testing that there is no SLIDE  ENHANCEMENT SUPPORT, IN THE SIDE AREAS ?  think a teflon / bronze equalizer  at the bolt  to side contact area  would dramatically  improve all the violent side  to side play . basically a  slide block to eliminate  buzzing , front  to back motion , is assured , empty side to side play , is the  cause / reason for consistent failure . often see that in a similar failure point , have to control the incremental start / stop , side to side empty  point . pete  

Credits belong to tuber.

 

[Handy Don 12,206]

Definitely misleading.

If the nyloc has not moved on the bolt, then any “preload” loss is due to loss of metal or bending somewhere--off any or all of the fixture bushings, the bottom of the nut, the underside of the bolt head, or (far less likely) on the bolt or nut threads where they are meshed within the nut.

Also, to me 6 lbs of torque is only 20% of the 31 lb. spec for a standard grade ⅜-16 bolt, especially one intending to capture a piece with no movement as in the use case for this test.

All this proves to me is that an improper assembly can fail--surprise surprise.

 

If I’d submitted a lab report for a test like this in college, I’d have received no higher than a D grade.

[adsm08 2,046]

20 hours ago, Handy Don said:

Definitely misleading.

If the nyloc has not moved on the bolt, then any “preload” loss is due to loss of metal or bending somewhere--off any or all of the fixture bushings, the bottom of the nut, the underside of the bolt head, or (far less likely) on the bolt or nut threads where they are meshed within the nut.

Also, to me 6 lbs of torque is only 20% of the 31 lb. spec for a standard grade ⅜-16 bolt, especially one intending to capture a piece with no movement as in the use case for this test.

All this proves to me is that an improper assembly can fail--surprise surprise.

 

If I’d submitted a lab report for a test like this in college, I’d have received no higher than a D grade.

 

 

This is not how I was taught to calculate torque values Don.

 

I was always taught, at least for SAE bolts, that the fraction was the drive size of the impact, and then you take the smallest common fraction (1/4 1/3, 1/2 etc) that produces a whole number on the integer, and that's you ugga-dugga factor.

 

So your 3/8-16 bolt takes a 3/8 drive impact at 4 ugga duggas.

[ebinmaine 67,401]

30 minutes ago, adsm08 said:

 

 

This is not how I was taught to calculate torque values Don.

 

I was always taught, at least for SAE bolts, that the fraction was the drive size of the impact, and then you take the smallest common fraction (1/4 1/3, 1/2 etc) that produces a whole number on the integer, and that's you ugga-dugga factor.

 

So your 3/8-16 bolt takes a 3/8 drive impact at 4 ugga duggas.

 

I've known @Handy Don for a few years. He's pretty precise about things. 

 

I can definitely see the value in your ratios though.  

 

Question. 

Does the Ugga Dugga ratio change if you're using an air impact vs electric?  Or if electric,  battery vs corded?

 

 

[peter lena 8,606]

@ bc-gold , used to service , vertical conveyors , horizontal conveyors , and  horizontal sifters , that ran 24 / 7 , absolute  cure is having matching impact connections , every part was size to size fit ,  https://www.sweco.com/?gad_source=1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI55_yuJ2fiAMV72BHAR2tZzvDEAAYASAAEgLBl_D_BwE  we ran these sifters  , till the motors failed , the spring controlled movement insured , consistent function without , anything  coming loose . hot / dusty conditions . most common failure was the motors , not the related spring held , base and frame mount . pete 

[Handy Don 12,206]

2 hours ago, adsm08 said:

So your 3/8-16 bolt takes a 3/8 drive impact at 4 ugga duggas

 

1 hour ago, ebinmaine said:

Does the Ugga Dugga ratio change if you're using an air impact vs electric?  Or if electric,  battery vs corded?

 

Ok, I definitely need a new set of reference documents! 

And by the way, are Ugga Duggas only imperial or do they work in metric as well or do I need to also practice my “ga-zintas”?

 

[ebinmaine 67,401]

45 minutes ago, Handy Don said:

 

 

Ok, I definitely need a new set of reference documents! 

And by the way, are Ugga Duggas only imperial or do they work in metric as well or do I need to also practice my “ga-zintas”?

 

 

 

This should work well on both measuring systems.  

[adsm08 2,046]

8 hours ago, Handy Don said:

 

 

Ok, I definitely need a new set of reference documents! 

And by the way, are Ugga Duggas only imperial or do they work in metric as well or do I need to also practice my “ga-zintas”?

 

 

The formula for deriving the metric ugga dugga is different. You multiply the pitch by the diameter and round the product to the integer.

Edited August 31 by adsm08

[adsm08 2,046]

10 hours ago, ebinmaine said:

 

I've known @Handy Don for a few years. He's pretty precise about things. 

 

I can definitely see the value in your ratios though.  

 

Question. 

Does the Ugga Dugga ratio change if you're using an air impact vs electric?  Or if electric,  battery vs corded?

 

 

 

I was taught these formulas before electric was common, and for anything I'm actually using an impact on I don't trust electric enough. Only air for this grease monkey.