Automatic transmission vs standard.

[Tooonz 4]

Hello I’m new to this group. I am looking to purchase another wheel horse. I had one about 17 years ago that was my father’s. It was a 1967 I think it was a model 600 or something like that basic tractor with an 8 horse Briggs. I loved that machine. Anyway fast forward I’m looking for another. I came across a charger 12 automatic. I know nothing about these transmissions.

 

my uses use will be lawn mowing and using the plow to re grade some sections of my lawn. I used my father’s old tractor to do that and it was amazing with the plow. 
 

this machine has both the mowing deck and a plow. Exactly what I want but I am curious about the transmission.

 

any help would be appreciated. Thanks in advance.

[kpinnc 12,005]

A hydro for mowing is a great option. No clutch to push and release for direction changes, and you have infinitely adjustable speed. So you can speed up in thin grass and slow down in heavy spots. 

 

The Chargers came with Sundstrand hydros. The three I've owned all had the earliest "hydrogear" version, as does my Bronco in the second pic below. So long as they were properly maintained (or possibly left alone), they are excellent. They came from the factory with ATF fluid, and later Wheel Horse released a bulletin allowing the use of 30W motor oil. Personally, I prefer ATF for it's wear and rust preventive qualities. 

 

The Chargers did not have hydraulic lift, though it can be added if the valve parts can be found. 

 

There should be a dipstick under the rear fender. You may need a wrench to loosen it. It should be clean, with no rust or garbage on it. If the fluid has a red tint, it's ATF. Motor oil will be brown. Either should be clear and clean. 

 

If the tractor runs, drive it around for a few minutes. It takes 5-10 minutes to warm up in summer weather. If you have a hill or good incline around, take it up and see if it maintains power throughout the climb. It might whine a little, but should power through to the point of spinning the wheels. It should also have limited slip, so it won't spin much like an 8-pinion. 

 

If it weakens climbing (after warming up) it's a worn out hydro. These can be rebuilt, but parts aren't easy to come by. 

 

Good luck! I hope it's a great find for you. I love my Bronco and the Charger that I gave my FIL (first pic). They are great machines. 

 

[moe1965 737]

When you go and look at the tractor take a close look at the wheel hubs. Grab a hold of the tire and rock it back and forth to see if it is loose.   Some tractors I have looked at the hubs were wiped out and most of the time the axles suffer damage as well due to neglect.  I believe most of this damage is due to not letting the tractor come to a complete stop before changing direction .  Just my two cents. Other than that I especially take a hydro for mowing any day

[Tooonz 4]

Thanks for the info , sounds like the hydro ( automatic) is great for mowing, how are they for pushing? Nothing crazy just pushing loam. If I remember my old one had 3 speeds and reverse. The pictures I posted below aren’t my tractor , but one that I just saw for sale, this resembles my father’s old tractor except the decals were different. However it was a barebones wheelhouse and that tractor was a beast. Same rear tires as this one below. We used to haul trees with that tractor. Would I be better off with a manual transmission for pushing dirt? 

[kpinnc 12,005]

11 minutes ago, Tooonz said:

sounds like the hydro ( automatic) is great for mowing, how are they for pushing?

 

A good hydro should give as much power as any manual transmission. The only difference is if you really place a hydro in a bind, the ensuing damage can be more expensive to fix. 

 

Also- you need to keep the cooling fins on the pump clean, and the fan should be in good shape as well. Heat is as much an enemy of hydros as is running low on oil. 

[oliver2-44 9,732]

I have a 160 Hydro and have done significant reshaping, cutting soil 6" and moving to level a complete back yard.  I used a front plow, rear box blade with rippers, and a grader blade.   In the front yard I got 50 yards (5, 10yd trucks) of fill from a new house pool and septic system.  Take small bites and  worked it down.  I  have 60 lb of weigh on each rear tire.  i run turf tires with chains.  I have the hydro lift and can constantly feather the implement up and down as I hear it loading up or starting to spin.  It will spin and dig a hole before you ever bog it down.      

[daveoman1966 3,751]

The Charger 12 would be a good choice for anyone.  The Sundstrand Hydrogear 90-2046 is more robust than the later Sundstrand Piston-to-Piston (90-1136 or 90-1140) that started in 1973.  I think the Charger 12 also has the 10-pinion Limited Slip Differential. I like that b/c both wheels spin if in a 'stucky' situation instead of just one wheel (---or when pushing snow).  Here is one (not mine) with a 48" deck.  The only thing I'd do to the Charger 12 is to convert (upgrade) the deck pulley system from the old style side mule drive to the much better front mule drive.   Here are the upgrade parts.  PS---I have a FREE download of how to make this upgrade---takes an hour or so---NO WELDING.      

Edited June 3 by daveoman1966

[953 nut 55,188]

I have both gear and hydro Wheel Horses and have a personal preference for gear drive. The hydro will be better for mowing if you have to make frequent changes of direction, our yard is large enough that I hardly ever have to shift the manual trans.

A fifty year old hydro will work well if it has been properly maintained. As mentioned above you will want to test the hydro before you agree to buy it, once warmed up you can chain it to a tree and see if it will spin the tires or just get wimpey and sit there. It should be equally strong in forward and reverse. The limited slip is a good feature as is the hydraulic lift on the Charger.

[Ed Kennell 38,134]

8 minutes ago, 953 nut said:

chain it to a tree and see if it will spin the tires

This is the method I use to test all my hydros.    I have only found one Sundstrand that would not spin the tires.

Please be aware it may have motor oil (amber)  or ATF (pink) as lubricant.  Do not mix the two.

 

 to the 

Edited June 3 by Ed Kennell

[Tooonz 4]

I finally figured out which tractor my father had. So this is all I know and have experience with. He had a workhorse 700. And if my memory is correct I believe it was a 67. No lights no chrome strips like this one lol. 

[rjg854 11,360]

  seems the boys have you covered already, nothing much more to add, except good luck.

[oliver2-44 9,732]

As said the Charge is a great choice if it checks out.  

Just so your aware, the 700, 800 and A series tractors had a lighter duty transmission.  They certainly could be used for light duty snow, dirt work.  But not on a routine basis.  Not the 3.4.6.8 speed "Unidrive" gear and hydro transmissions that was designed for snow & soil engaging work.

[Tooonz 4]

Great info, we used that 700 to haul trees out of the woods when I was a kid, lol never had an issue with it . Looks like we were lucky. 

[Ed Kennell 38,134]

20 hours ago, kpinnc said:

A hydro for mowing is a great option.

I've used three foot controlled hydros for ten years.       IMO, they are a necessity for snow work..plow and blowers.

I also use them for mowing and also find the infinite motion a great feature.

Last year I bought a 310-8 with a 42" SD and liked the way it cuts in wide open spaces.    Unfortunately I have been mowing off the flowers, barking my fruit trees, and bruising up my arms on tree limbs.  Seems my muscle memory tells me to raise my right foot to slow the tractor.  Of course that does not work with a gear drive.