Is ethanol free fuel really worth it?

[PWL216 889]

I’ve been following some of the posts/comments about using ethanol free fuel, and its benefits. So I thought maybe I’d give it a try. I checked the prices here locally and the best price I found was $6.50 a gallon. That’s roughly double what I pay for regular gas. Is it really worth spending that much extra money or would you be better off rebuilding or replacing the carburetor every 10 years (or whatever the time frame would be)? I recently picked up at 312–8 with 3000 hours on it. I’m sure they never used ethanol free fuel. I’m curious as to what percentage of people on this form use ethanol free gas and if they feel the value is there for the extra money. 

[Racinbob 11,088]

I use it in the tractors and generator but it's not that much more that regular. I can't say if it actually helps because I've never experienced the issues I've read about. 

[Ed Kennell 38,209]

I have used 10% ethanol in everything(2 and 4 stroke outboards, tractors, autos) for many years.   Never have any problems.   I do try to keep fresh fuel in the tanks and mix a special cocktail for long term storage.

[elcamino/wheelhorse 9,317]

I have used the 10 % ethanol since they started making it. Never had a problem, I dump so sea Foam in tank everything I fuel the tractors. About the only area that I could buy non -ethanol would be about 50 miles from home.

[daveoman1966 3,752]

This is the carb from my K241 engine.  See all that jelly-like sh__ in the bowl.  THAT is what ethanol-gas does.  

I, for one, with NEVER...not EVER... use anything but Ethanol-FREE gas in my tractors.  

  

[squonk 41,150]

Ethanol shortens fuel line life. Ethanol rated fuel line is quite expensive. Ethanol attracts moisture and attacks the metals long term in a carburetor and metal fuel tanks. I have seen fuel bowls with ethanol fuel and Stabil mix look like pink jelly. Several stations around me ethanol free gas for about a buck a gallon more than the 10%. Ethanol also has fewer BTU's than regular unleaded so you use more to get the same amount of power. 

[Brockport Bill 1,668]

i began using the ethanol free gas 1 yr ago based on various online chats as well as here -- for me, i know of no real way to measure or judge its $$ value -- it's not like we can measure gas milage or quantify "cleanliness" of carb or plugs -- to a lay person, not a mechanical expert like me it seems so subjective --- so without some empirical measure how will i know? I would need some kind of control group or side by side comparison -- how would i do that? Would have to have a same engine with same use side by side? So for me i just thought, "well they are older engines -- the ethanol free just seems to make sense"? But then i read the other day an opinion that ethanol free with higher octane (which is all that's available here)  is actually NOT healthy for the older engines  -- something to do with the combustion of higher octane is actually bad for these engines -- Again -- i emphasize, i dont really understand the science or chemistry of the two different gasolines in small engines??????? I do know here in the Hudson River Valley, NY i have only found one conveneient gas station and the cost is $1 to $1.50 more per gallon -- so i have to ask... how do i determine the short and long term dollar value, or longvity, or operational, or maintenance benefits?? Any insights are welcome?

[rmaynard 15,509]

Here where I live, ethanol-free is a higher (93) octane and only about $1.00 more than regular 87 octane. I have been using it in every small engine product that I own, 2 stroke and 4. No issues. Before I switched, I would put Sta-bil in the tank in the fall, and when they wouldn't start in the spring, I found the same crap in the bowl as what Dave pictured above. Further, I don't waste my money on Seafoam after I read the ingredients. So in answer to your question, yes, e-free is worth the money, but look for a cheaper source.

[lynnmor 7,307]

I have had ethanol problems in snowmobiles when it first arrived in Maine.  The ethanol sucked up the water in fuel storage tanks and it wound up in our snowmobiles.  Most of that problem went away in a couple of years. 

 

I only use ethanol free in cans that I have for pre-mix that is used in chainsaws, blower and weed trimmers because storage time is highly variable.  If the cost were only a bit more I would use it in everything because of the better mileage and less risk of having a problem.  The spread between 0% and 10% varies across the country, the corn states have the best prices.

 

For those that have engines that are rarely used and not real workers, it might be best to spend more.  Know that our tractors have vented fuel systems and ethanol will suck the humidity right out or the air.  Draining the fuel system for storage is the best bet.

 

Staying on the edge of being political I'll just say that we should at least try to have folks that aren't backed by the Corn Lobby out of a place of authority.  I was surprised at some of comments made during recent events.

 

A comment about octane; yes ethanol has higher octane but requires considerably more fuel to take advantage of it.  The octane level in fuel for our tractors in a nothing burger.

[bds1984 1,435]

The only issue I have ever had with the ethanol fuel is when buying anything with an engine that has sat for years.  There is no telling how long it sat unused or fuel system condition until I start tearing into it. 
I run all my small engines year round so the ethanol portion of the equation doesn't really come into play and the stations I buy from are very high volume so the fuel is fresh.  If I DO have an engine sit for more than 4-6 weeks, I'll run the gas out of the carburetor.  I'd much rather take the extra step of running the fuel out versus cleaning out the rubber cement like the photo that Dave shared.  

 

[peter lena 8,634]

@daveoman1966  https://www.google.com/search?q=sta-bil+fuel+stabilizer+mix+ratio&rlz=1C1CHBF_enUS866US866&oq=sta+bil&gs_lcrp=EgZjaHJvbWUqDAgBECMYJxiABBiKBTIPCAAQ only use ethanol  fuel in my horses , also add an ounce of Stabil  fuel  storage additive , to all my gas , no pellets or hose break down , what am I doing wrong ? all fuel bowels are clean / clear , typically tried this years ago , as an experiment  against the crud in  tractor fuel system . never look back . also did a fuel hose change out , for a total fresh start , 2 filters , one close to tank  another close to carb , one of the points of Stabil is that it does not break down  fuel hoses , its a storage fuel enhancement , done many experiments , on chronic  problem areas , think the total fuel hose change out , carb bowl cleanout , filters , and zero related fuel  problems / clean fuel bowls , verifies the chemical fuel , change over . this consistently works for  me , clean/ clear , pete       

[JoeM 7,874]

As long as I can afford it and not traveling far to get it, I am using non e fuel. But it is only about a buck a gallon more here.  All my carb issues went away, the machines start easier in cold weather and use less fuel. I think it is a win to use. 

I have same experience a @daveoman1966 and @rmaynard 

Ethanol Pearls

 

I will say if storing machines for an extended period I like running them dry. Regardless of the fuel type. 

 

[Handy Don 12,235]

4 minutes ago, JoeM said:

I will say if storing machines for an extended period I like running them dry. Regardless of the fuel type. 

 

[JoeM 7,874]

I should have included, the bowl in the pic was fuel treated with Lucas fuel conditioner. 

I later found read were it doesn't work for other people etiher. 

[oliver2-44 9,759]

45 minutes ago, JoeM said:

As long as I can afford it and not traveling far to get it, I am using non e fuel. But it is only about a buck a gallon more here.  All my carb issues went away, the machines start easier in cold weather and use less fuel. I think it is a win to use. 

I have same experience a @daveoman1966 and @rmaynard 

Ethanol Pearls

 

I will say if storing machines for an extended period I like running them dry. Regardless of the fuel type. 

 

I can get  non-ethano fuel don\wn at the farm for $1 a gallon mor ethan regular.  Around where I live its about double the price. 

So I use mostly non ethanol, but occasionally need to use regular ethanol fuel during mowing season.

I make sure everything has non ethanol in it for any storage time.  Im not a fan of the additives. 

Some more pictures of ethanol crud.  

 

 

Note the pits and hole ate in this bowl

Edited January 19 by oliver2-44

[ebinmaine 67,589]

Around here we can get NON Ethanol gas for less than a buck more than the alcohol laced stuff. 

 

BBT and I use EXCLUSIVELY NON ETHANOL  in all our small engines. 

We also REQUIRE the two people who's machines we maintain to use NON Ethanol.  

 

I've seen rubber fuel lines heavily damaged in just a few weeks. 

I've seen all the examples as indicated above.  

 

I do NOT know of ANY add in chemicals that remove Ethanol from gas.  

 

I do NOT believe adding anything to gas eliminates the negative effects of Ethanol.  

 

I do believe that proper storage and immediate use of Ethanol gas is acceptable IF that's the only option or if the NON Ethanol gas is too expensive. 

 

Would I pay $6.50 a gallon? 

No. 

 

If I lived anywhere I had access to NON Ethanol gas within a reasonable time period of travel I'd get several 5 gallon containers and buy a few times a year. 

Long term storage seems fine. 

 

[Lee1977 6,663]

Non ethanol is worth every cent when it won't run right, or won't start, ethanol will rust a metal gas tank. I've read where there is not enough ethanol made for all the gas sold. The gas company has to pay the government for the gas sold without ethanol so that cost is past to the consumer. Some of you may not be getting 10% ethanol. consider yourself lucky if your not having problems.

 

Edited January 19 by Lee1977

[Brockport Bill 1,668]

i've been buying 20 gallons ethanol free at a time -- i put additive in the 5 gal jug when purchased - usually Stabil and/or SeaFoam -- i have no idea what, if anything, the additives accomplish? I suppose i should check if that YouTube guy who does all those sophisticated tests has done that testing with the additives -- or for that matter the ethanol versus NON ethanol?????

[ri702bill 8,327]

2 hours ago, ebinmaine said:

Would I pay $6.50 a gallon? 

No. 

Down here in "Rogues Island" I have to pay more than that for a QUART!! 

About $26.00 for a gallon - NOT!!! That just sucketh...

[kpinnc 12,083]

Ethanol fuel draws moisture from the air around it. As a general rule, introducing water to an air cooled, carbureted engine is a very bad idea. 

 

Feel free to look inside a mechanical fuel pump that has been exposed to Ethanol. If that doesn't do it, look in the carb jets. You may as well add 1/3 water in regular fuel to give the same effect.

 

Running the fuel out can be helpful, but only prolongs the inevitable. Your engine will lose prime and shut off far before all of the fuel is out of the system. 

 

Until a proper fuel injection conversion system is created for these engines, I will use ethanol free for as long as I can. 

Edited January 19 by kpinnc

[ebinmaine 67,589]

2 hours ago, Brockport Bill said:

i've been buying 20 gallons ethanol free at a time -- i put additive in the 5 gal jug when purchased - usually Stabil and/or SeaFoam -- i have no idea what, if anything, the additives accomplish? I suppose i should check if that YouTube guy who does all those sophisticated tests has done that testing with the additives -- or for that matter the ethanol versus NON ethanol?????

 

Likely you're referring to Project Farm. Taryl has also done some.  

 

The tests I'VE SEEN showed no positive impact.  

There may be others that show different.  

[Brockport Bill 1,668]

ahhh -- i will have to look them up - - thanks

[Brockport Bill 1,668]

28 minutes ago, kpinnc said:

Ethanol fuel draws moisture from the air around it. As a general rule, introducing water to an air cooled, carbureted engine is a very bad idea. 

 

Feel free to look inside a mechanical fuel pump that has been exposed to Ethanol. If that doesn't do it, look in the carb jets. You may as well add 1/3 water in regular fuel to give the same effect.

 

Running the fuel out can be helpful, but only prolongs the inevitable. Your engine will lose prime and shut off far before all of the fuel is out of the system. 

 

Until a proper fuel injection conversion system is created for these engines, I will use ethanol free for as long as I can. 

compelling info -- thanks -- I have planned to stay with non ethanol - over course of the year the extra $ cost is likely good value versus cost of replacement parts - - and certainly labor to  maintain and repair time -- oh yeah.... and stress aggrivation versus less 

[pfrederi 17,741]

Since i have a lot of WHs that are dedicated to a specific use and therefor only get used an hour or so a year they get non ethanol fuel. Mowers and other that get major use get regular gas...at eh end of there season I star runnig non ethanol.  i think storage is the issue.

[OutdoorEnvy 1,522]

I use ethanol free gas based on my average guy experiment some years ago.  Was doing a lot of interstate driving on a long trip in my 2004 silverado. 5.3 engine.  Did a tank of both.  The ethanol free got me about 2.5 miles more per gallon than the ethanol gas.  Also felt like it drove a little stronger when making passing pulls.  Nothing crazy but enough that I noticed a difference. 

 

Also have cleaned plenty of carbs with the jelly problems from ethanol sitting for long periods of time.  If it's a high use vehicle getting a tank of gas every week or so I don't think it's the worse thing.  But for better performance or if the vehicle will sit for a while ethanol free for sure.