Drones

[8ntruck 6,998]

Yesterday, as we were docking the pontoon after a ride around the lake,  I was tying one of the lines to the dock just after shutting the engine off.  My wife asked "what's that?".  

 

There was a drone hovering maybe 10 feet above the water and maybe 10 feet away from the pontoon - it seemed to be 'watching' us.  I waved at it and watched it for a bit.  After another 15 or 20 seconds it left.  Headed across the lake, presumably, to home.  'Home' was far enough away that I lost it in the background before I determined an accurate landing location.  I know within maybe 4 houses of where it might have landed.  We don't know any of the folks in those locations.

 

The whole episode just seemed a little creepy. 

 

Anybody else have similar experiences?

 

I joked with my wife that we need to acquire one of those Bug Assualt guns for drone defence. 

[Pullstart 62,834]

My wife found one hovering above her while hanging laundry on the line once.  You know we don’t have many neighbors… once she spotted it, it flew off.  She leaned a shotgun against the clothesline pole for a few weeks after that during laundry time.  It could easily have become a clay pigeon!

[8ntruck 6,998]

Clay pigeon.  I've had that same thought. 

 

Some reading I have done on that subject indicates that it typically turns out badly for the shooter.  

 

I really don't understand the reasoning behind that.  Usually explained as being  something along the lines of destroying personal property.

 

In my mind, it is removing a possible threat from my property or my person.  Also, by shòting it down, you would probably find out who the pilot/owner of the drone is.

 

I suppose yesterday's encounter was technically over the lake, and thus, on public property which would change the rules of engagement somewhat.

[JCM 9,130]

This is why we live in the woods. Shouldn't have to deal with something like this. Don't even get me started. Sorry you had to deal with invasion of your enjoying life. 

[Pullstart 62,834]

6 hours ago, 8ntruck said:

Clay pigeon.  I've had that same thought. 

 

Some reading I have done on that subject indicates that it typically turns out badly for the shooter.  

 

I really don't understand the reasoning behind that.  Usually explained as being  something along the lines of destroying personal property.

 

In my mind, it is removing a possible threat from my property or my person.  Also, by shòting it down, you would probably find out who the pilot/owner of the drone is.

 

I suppose yesterday's encounter was technically over the lake, and thus, on public property which would change the rules of engagement somewhat.

 

1 hour ago, JCM said:

This is why we live in the woods. Shouldn't have to deal with something like this. Don't even get me started. Sorry you had to deal with invasion of your enjoying life. 

Yeah.  Come and get your pieces, punk.  I’ll be ready.  

[lynnmor 7,305]

Any aircraft is governed by laws that will have you in a heap of trouble if you harm it, doesn’t matter if it is manned or not.  There are laws about flying over people so check if those laws are violated and then turn them in to get the harassment stopped.

[Horse Newbie 7,068]

1 hour ago, Pullstart said:

Yeah.  Come and get your pieces, punk.  I’ll be ready

Go ahead …make my clay…

(pigeon that is)

Do you feel lucky, Punk ?

Edited September 23, 2023 by Horse Newbie

[8ntruck 6,998]

2 hours ago, lynnmor said:

Any aircraft is governed by laws that will have you in a heap of trouble if you harm it, doesn’t matter if it is manned or not.  There are laws about flying over people so check if those laws are violated and then turn them in to get the harassment stopped.

Would mooning the drone be considered harming it?

[ri702bill 8,316]

I'm partial to using a fire hose water cannon to "deter" said annoyance.......

[WHX?? 48,814]

I'd just flipped it the bird and went about my business. 

[8ntruck 6,998]

 We waved instead.

 

After sleeping on it, I've cone to the conclusion that the relatively close proximity of the thing, the presence of a camera, and not knowing who was operating it were what created the 'creep' factor.

 

If it were somebody floating on an inner tube in the same spot, we could have at least traded greetings verbally.

 

Might be that I am turning into a grumpy oil man, too.  You know "GET OFF THE GRASS!".

[SylvanLakeWH 25,533]

1 hour ago, WHX?? said:

I'd just flipped it the bird and went about my business. 

 

Oh the horror...  What If it was operated by a snowflake? you might offend its feelings... and that would be sad...  

 

Perhaps a diversion when you hear next it coming... get operator's attention with appropriate bait (bikini clad volunteer) and as they follow the lure, "someone unknown" and off camera accidentally creates a major malfunction utilizing true gun control (uses both hands) 

[Handy Don 12,211]

4 hours ago, 8ntruck said:

Would mooning the drone be considered harming it?

Might make you a meme on Instagram.

 

15 minutes ago, SylvanLakeWH said:

 

Oh the horror...  What If it was operated by a snowflake? you might offend its feelings... and that would be sad...  

 

Perhaps a diversion when you hear next it coming... get operator's attention with appropriate bait (bikini clad volunteer) and as they follow the lure, "someone unknown" and off camera accidentally creates a major malfunction utilizing true gun control (uses both hands) 

It it were to “fall” into the lake and be unrecoverable...

[Tractorhead 9,064]

I‘m writing because i‘m a legal Drone Operator. 

Drones can be used i.eg for doing automated Tasks depending on the Drone itself.

Like i do Fawn Saving before Mow, the reason‘s to fly a drone can vary.

 

The most cheap Handy based Dronez have just a reachable Video range of 150-250 meters not more.

The dronez can fly much more about 1 Km but without a real usable Video link.

To solve that distance with life Video you need to invest much more money than a cheap up to 150$ Drone.

 

Maybe it was a commercial or legal flight or an curious Idiot - hard to say.

Depending on what reason it was, that drone was flying for.

You told the middle of the Sea, how far was the difference to you about when you see it and how far was the drone away from

the Start place on the other Side?

 

That flight can have differently reasons, counting some populations on the Sea via goverment or counting gooses or other Animals 

even recreational purposes be legal as long as it ain‘t fly over any Persons or their property without permission.

Even a simple Flyaway can be happen drone stops somewhere and stay there until Batteries reach it’s limit - 

if you be lucky the Failsafe system bring it by GPS back.

 

To fly directly over Persons you need a higher License and a Starting Permission by countyside local Air Administration

and even a Insurance in case of an Accident.

Without that permission and license you just be allowed at least 300m far from crowds or peoples or even their properties to fly.

 

This rules be finally established since 2022 and be international valid - just the Costs for the License and exact difference regulations may vary a little from Country to Country. 

Each drone - independently where - being strongly reglemented by Air Administration and needs an Sign wich identify the owner.

 

The ignore of that reglementation be hardly sanctioned and they must be Accepted before you be allowed to Start any kind of Drone

except Child Toys - but they be hardly restricted about range and weight and about what is a Toy and what not.

 

Ask your local Police, they normally should be able to verify, if it was an official Flight for whatever reason or not.

Even if it was inofficial, they be warned and can take care, if that happens again to Stop that Pilot if he doing something wrong.

Additionally the Dronepilot was warned „you not be a good point to observe“.

Also they have his personalities in case of another annoying.

As long as they ain‘t fly over your Property you be not allowed to claypigeon it.

 

If they fly over your Property without asking for permission, they be illegal over your Head

and „claypigeon it“ was much easier declared as self defence.

 

However - 

Claypigeon any drone ain‘t be a good idea at all.

The Batteries will be ignit themself immediately if they harmed and caught immediately on Fire what cannot be stopped

while burning because they build their own Oxygen while Burning.

 

So each try of Fire distinguish ain‘t possible and ends with a completely burned down battery.

depending on Battery Size we talking about 5 min up to 15 min.

The heat comes up to 700*C out of the Battery. - not a good idea.

 

 

A good Point to start prevent drone flights over your property this is with a 2,4 GHz Jammer

and a strong directional Antenna.( typically a right handed 7-9 turn Helix Antenna) will do the Trick. 

That don‘t destroy anything but if the Transmission between drone and the Operator is lost or overwritten,

each drone fly back to its Starting Point via GPS.

 

A GPS jammer is another funny thing that could help additionally for Hardcore Idiots they don‘t accept any rules.

In this case the drone will land immediately where it is because of fail of its GPS location.

It doesn‘t know where it is so it can just will Land immediately.

So in your case it‘s middle in the Sea. - No Fire no problems no

 

The dis - both Actions be not for everyone legal - ask you local HAM Radio Guy‘s if they can help you.

Take a look in the Web for your Localisation and HAM Radio and you get info‘s how to reach this guy‘s.

They normally allway’s be willing to help and have some legal „options“ they can officially do.

 

 

There Shure be some other things they can be done, but they be grey colored and i wan‘t discuss it here in a official Forum.

 

 

 

 

[Ed Kennell 38,130]

The Supreme Court is trying to protect ‘unsuspecting sunbathers’ from voyeurs with drones as it grapples with invasive technology | National Post

[8ntruck 6,998]

I was hoping to hear from you @Tractorhead.  I know that you were working with drones to find fawns in farmer's fields to keep them safe from agricultural machinery.  I thank you for adding a responsible operator's view to the thread.

 

The drone looked like a hobby drone.  White in color, 4 props maybe 100mm in diameter.  It was hovering over the lake about 8m from the shore, 2 to 3 m away from our boat, slightly above head level as we stood on the deck.  It's apparent home was across the lake maybe 500m away. 

 

I'm pretty sure that this was not a commercial drone.  The proximity of the drone to the boat puts the operator in a gray area of legal operation.  I'm not sure any level of license allows remote operation that close to people.

 

I spent some time reading about what our Federal Avaition Administration regulations say about recreational drones.  To sum things up, people on the ground cannot shoot them down, interfere with their communications or control systems, or shine lasers at them.  The operator cannot exceed 400 ft in altitude, operate the drone in an unsafe manner, or use them for spying or survalance.  The operator also needs to register a drone that is heavier than 250gr.  

 

Complaints start with local law enforcement. If you have enough evidence of improper operation and can identify the drone, a complaint can be filed with the FAA.

 

Most of the people on that side of the lake are weekenders.  It is late enough in the season that I don't expect to see it again. If it comes back in the future and becomes a nuisance, I will start carrying my cell phone to documentany encounters with pictures and video.  I'll also try to find the operator and have a discussion as well.

[Tonytoro416 1,034]

The company I work for in the agricultural business is supposed to be trying some drones out at our particular location and I feel there will be some potential issues arise. We will utilizing them to spray fungicides and spread cover crop. Last week we did just under 200 acres of cover crop mix ryegrass and radish.  I think we are bound to have some issues arise 

[Tractorhead 9,064]

@8ntruck

 

What you describe is not an „maybe violation“ it is not a „grey lined use“ it is definitely a rules violation.

2-3 meter far from people or a boat is not allowed.

 

additionally 

If he is out of sight he is not allowed to fly only via Camera, except he has a so called spotter aside.

Flying out of sight just by camera using is just allowed for short distances like 100-200m

and the spotter must be able to see the drone by bare eyesight without glasses or similar.

 

 

To say it is a toy or a qualified drone is sometimes hard to say just by seeing it.

 

Lots of drones be in the cheap segment and the quality increases the last few years.

Some be in a little higher pricy segment, i payed for my mini drone close to 200$ What is definitely a cheapo one.

I was curious of what i get for that price.

This thing weights 468 gramms with battery so it must be registered there is no doubt.

There are 3 different types of licenses they allow different uses.

 

 

In the beginning, i was just be able to have a Video connection for about 150m than the video freezes the drone itself can fly much wider.  - dang digital trash - so i removed the digital Camera gunk and installed an Analog Video system i had allready from my old high speed Racing Drone. 

This Video system is combined with special Antenna technology that allows me an stable Videolink over 1,5 Km without badly distortions. I have not a video recorder in use because i don‘t need it, i save my GPS locations at finding and save this markers via GPS on a sd card.

 

From outside it looks like the original drone - except of the Dual camera Mount i need for the Thermal Camera.

( it is a quick changer between Video Cam and Thermal Cam depening on use)

But Most of it‘s integrated electronics be completely changed.

 

At first i was curious about the Manufacturers Data about flight times, they mostly lie about.

- offered 28 minutes - for me that was hard to believe and i thought so real 10-15 min of flight time will be the Deal.

like my bigger Dronez can do.

 

in fact it flies in original without any modification 24 minutes - what is definitely close to their offer.

after i rework it, it losts 68 gramms of weight and the flight time becomes true 26 minutes per battery.

Dang - that is an Announcement.

 

 

 

The biggest Problem also here as there is the cheap dronez will be sold from „Toy Companies“.

Most of them ignore the rules of use.

Sale go for Safety

[WHX?? 48,814]

17 hours ago, SylvanLakeWH said:

What If it was operated by a snowflake? 

What if it operated by a crook & casing his 'toon for fishing gear? 

Just sayin... 

[Ed Kennell 38,130]

4 minutes ago, WHX?? said:

What if it operated by a crook & casing his 'toon for fishing gear? 

Just sayin... 

What, you mean crooks and drug dealers may not abide by the drone and gun laws?

[Tonytoro416 1,034]

5 hours ago, Tractorhead said:

@8ntruck

 

What you describe is not an „maybe violation“ it is not a „grey lined use“ it is definitely a rules violation.

2-3 meter far from people or a boat is not allowed.

 

additionally 

If he is out of sight he is not allowed to fly only via Camera, except he has a so called spotter aside.

Flying out of sight just by camera using is just allowed for short distances like 100-200m

and the spotter must be able to see the drone by bare eyesight without glasses or similar.

 

 

To say it is a toy or a qualified drone is sometimes hard to say just by seeing it.

 

Lots of drones be in the cheap segment and the quality increases the last few years.

Some be in a little higher pricy segment, i payed for my mini drone close to 200$ What is definitely a cheapo one.

I was curious of what i get for that price.

This thing weights 468 gramms with battery so it must be registered there is no doubt.

There are 3 different types of licenses they allow different uses.

 

 

In the beginning, i was just be able to have a Video connection for about 150m than the video freezes the drone itself can fly much wider.  - dang digital trash - so i removed the digital Camera gunk and installed an Analog Video system i had allready from my old high speed Racing Drone. 

This Video system is combined with special Antenna technology that allows me an stable Videolink over 1,5 Km without badly distortions. I have not a video recorder in use because i don‘t need it, i save my GPS locations at finding and save this markers via GPS on a sd card.

 

From outside it looks like the original drone - except of the Dual camera Mount i need for the Thermal Camera.

( it is a quick changer between Video Cam and Thermal Cam depening on use)

But Most of it‘s integrated electronics be completely changed.

 

At first i was curious about the Manufacturers Data about flight times, they mostly lie about.

- offered 28 minutes - for me that was hard to believe and i thought so real 10-15 min of flight time will be the Deal.

like my bigger Dronez can do.

 

in fact it flies in original without any modification 24 minutes - what is definitely close to their offer.

after i rework it, it losts 68 gramms of weight and the flight time becomes true 26 minutes per battery.

Dang - that is an Announcement.

 

 

 

The biggest Problem also here as there is the cheap dronez will be sold from „Toy Companies“.

Most of them ignore the rules of use.

Sale go for Safety

I agree with this for sure.  They agriculture ones are anywhere from 20,000-40,000 dollars 

[Tractorhead 9,064]

@Tonytoro416

An adequate compartment to mine with 4 Batteries is here sold for about 6000US $

I payed less than 1/6 - except the Thermal Camera.

That is Mil Standart in High Resolution and cost a lot more than the whole Drone Hardware.

It allway‘s depending for what purposes the Drone will or shall be used.

 

The Thermal Cam raised the Price in a dang hard 2800 range all together.

but just for video transmission up to 1,5 Km it was about 150$

If you must carry heavier loads, the whole construction becomes more heavy and requires an A3 License

to be legal able to fly it. It also require here a Start permission for each flight.

 

 

The statement „Drone“ isn‘t in my Opinion a sensefully description for a dedicated Machine.

It just describe an mostly fully autonom „automated Machine“ - independently if it flies, Walk, Drive, Hover or even Swim.

Lifting loads with a Flying drone needs massive Hardware what quickly increases the cost of this System.

Additionally the Heavier the Gros weight, the more Dangerous is that thing over Anybody‘s Heads.

Or in other words - the required Safety purposes increases analog with the gros weight.

Maybe a Winged Modelaircraft will be also  for your needs with a Sprayer mounted on it.

 

A Sprayer Multirotor can be from 500gramms of load up to 25 Kilograms of Load.

easy to imagine what be dangerously 

if 500 gramms drop down of if nearly 30 Kilos drop down.

The impact and/or the size of needed Battery make also a huge different in this case.

So Maybe a Gaspowered Winged Modelaircraft can also do the Trick for your needs.

Here the Rules between a winged Aircraft used for Agriculture support with heavier Loads or a heavier multirotor be the same.

 

Both can be built as a „Drone“ even bigger Airplane Modells can be fully Automated for different Tasks.

Automatic Start and Landing is not longer impossible as long as the place is available.

Flight controllers are able to do that all fully autonom and with a Gas Engine they can reach unbelievable ranges.

This new field „ Drones“ is still very young but the possibilities raising extremely quick.

 

[The Freightliner Guy 1,327]

ive had a drone follow me around when i was cruising on the dirt on a three wheeler. maybe they wanted to see what i was doing? or if i was up to no good? maybe it was a cop? i dunno it got real close once and i tested to see if it was following me so id go all over the place and it kept just flying behind me. maybe they are a fan of three wheelers? if so id rather they come and talk to me then follow me with a drone.