mort 24 #1 Posted August 11, 2023 (edited) I have a 418A and still having problems with the PTO lever as I still need to move it (wiggle it) to start the tractor. I bought new switches and wondering if I have them mounted on the bracket correctly. My parts and service 418A manual shows them incorrectly mounted (flipped) IMO. I think I have them mounted correctly see below. It would have been very helpful if I had my phone on me before I started. LOL! Also there are two sets of wire plugs that get hooked up to the 2 switches. One is wired NC Normally Closed and the other NO Normally Open Which wire do I want on the bottom switch? NC or NO? Thanks, Mort I thought I would add in the old switches to the post. As you see the switch with the 3 way white plastic connector has the blue wire on the NC normally closed terminal (top terminal nearest hinge lever/actuator). The other switch has wire connectors on the NO Normally Open terminal. Since there are two switches and they are using NC and NO differently on each switch and since one will be on the bottom and one on the top I think it does make a difference as to location of NC and NO. The PTO lever is in one position at start and in another position to activate the PTO. I believe the bottom of the PTO lever hits these switches at different times. Which wire do I want on the bottom switch and why? NC or NO? Thanks, Mort Edited August 12, 2023 by mort Added old switches to the post Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gwest_ca-(File Mod) 11,090 #2 Posted August 11, 2023 Does not matter if the wires are in a connector. If they are not in a connector it makes a difference. Click on the picture of the switch above and there is another pic of the switches and wiring. Blue and orange go to the NO for the magneto ignition with the pto off. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gwest_ca-(File Mod) 11,090 #3 Posted August 12, 2023 There is a good chance I am not correct. I do not know if the switches are activated when the pto is off or on. Pays to look at the wiring diagram Ignition - NC contacts are open when the pto is off Starter - NO contacts are closed when the pto is off 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
peter lena 8,716 #4 Posted August 12, 2023 @mort , @gwest_ca , while I agree on the wiring , take the time to detail that in , eliminate wire chafing , stressed cracked areas , that area behind dash is a GOLD MINE FOR CORRECTIONS , once I started doing that , problems went away . pto lever assist , added rectifier grounding , steering shaft flange bearing . just a suggestion , pete Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Handy Don 12,436 #5 Posted August 16, 2023 (edited) No worries! I can confirm @gwest_ca’s thought... BOTH switches are the same electrically. They BOTH have NC and NO contacts. Unless you (or some PO) has messed with the wiring going into the connectors (and from the images, I’d guess that no one has), those 3-conductor connectors themselves put each wire on its correct terminal (note that the connector attaches to the switch body in only one direction)! I see, though, that one of the switches isn’t using the 3-conductor connector. For that, you’ll have to trace those wires to their source and match to the wiring diagram to see where they connect to the switch. 🙂 As for mounting, I can only point out that as the tab on the PTO lever comes into contact with the levers on the switches it should touch their hinged ends first. Edited August 16, 2023 by Handy Don Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JCM 9,328 #6 Posted August 16, 2023 Having this same issue on my 420-LSE . when I bought it one of the switches was disconnected. I have recently refurbed the consoles and had a no start issue. I found I had to slightly move the PTO lever to start the engine, took a few minutes to figure that one out. The PTO lever is tight with no play in it whatsoever. I consider it for now an anti theft device to be able to start it. Problem is you never know when it will do it. I'm lost for now. Also both switches were replaced while I was in there. 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Handy Don 12,436 #7 Posted August 16, 2023 28 minutes ago, JCM said: I found I had to slightly move the PTO lever to start the engine I’m going to go out on a limb and suggest that either: - the bracket holding the switches is not positioned correctly relative to the tab on the PTO lever to fully engage both of the switches, or - the PTO lever, while not having play, is not coming fully back toward the operator in the disengaged position (i.e. just might be dialed to be too firm on engaging the PTO?) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JCM 9,328 #8 Posted August 16, 2023 4 hours ago, Handy Don said: I’m going to go out on a limb and suggest that either: - the bracket holding the switches is not positioned correctly relative to the tab on the PTO lever to fully engage both of the switches, or - the PTO lever, while not having play, is not coming fully back toward the operator in the disengaged position (i.e. just might be dialed to be too firm on engaging the PTO?) Thanks for the advice Don. The PTO lever does seem to be coming back toward the operator like all my other tractors. If I stand on the right hand side of the tractor and grab the PTO lever and push on it at the top ( black grip } and start to lift the tractor off it's right side wheels ever so slightly I can hear the contacts click then just touch the key and it fires right up. It is in a spot where you really can't get a good view of it. To clarify lifting it's right side I am just taking the weight off the right side ever so slightly not actually lifting the tractor if you get my drift, but there is no play in the lever. The nyliner bushing was in good shape so I did not replace it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mort 24 #9 Posted August 16, 2023 10 hours ago, Handy Don said: No worries! I can confirm @gwest_ca’s thought... BOTH switches are the same electrically. They BOTH have NC and NO contacts. Unless you (or some PO) has messed with the wiring going into the connectors (and from the images, I’d guess that no one has), those 3-conductor connectors themselves put each wire on its correct terminal (note that the connector attaches to the switch body in only one direction)! I see, though, that one of the switches isn’t using the 3-conductor connector. For that, you’ll have to trace those wires to their source and match to the wiring diagram to see where they connect to the switch. 🙂 As for mounting, I can only point out that as the tab on the PTO lever comes into contact with the levers on the switches it should touch their hinged ends first. Thank you! Mort Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
