Rubber Roads?

[Rick3478 428]

In the vein of thinking outside the box, I wonder if we didn't make a mistake paving our

roadways with concrete and asphalt and putting rubber tires on vehicles.

 

Rubber tires wear out fairly rapidly, and occasionally fail while in motion, which is dangerous.

 

But what if, instead, we pave roads with rubber?  The road has to be periodically repaved

anyway, so why not something cushy?  Vehicles could then have durable, long lasting

metal, plastic, or ceramic wheels that would be much safer.

 

Thoughts?

 

[Stormin 9,981]

6 minutes ago, Rick3478 said:

  Vehicles could then have durable, long lasting

metal, plastic, or ceramic wheels.

 

 Be a bit rough off the paved road.

[CCW 1,295]

Not sure a rubber road would wear well.  

[JCM 9,172]

   

[squonk 41,136]

I've always thought about adding ground up tires into the pavement mix.

[Pullstart 62,905]

1 minute ago, squonk said:

I've always thought about adding ground up tires into the pavement mix.

I’ll donate a few!

[Pullstart 62,905]

I would imagine that a rubber road could cause some funky shockwaves if you will, once 40,000+ lbs of momentum multiplied by however many trucks cross through.  If you can visualize the rubber being compressed in a lateral motion, then unraveling it could be detrimental.  I see it like crossing ice at a certain speed (Ice Road Truckers, etc.)

[Rick3478 428]

1 hour ago, CCW said:

Not sure a rubber road would wear well.  

Not a well as concrete or asphalt, certainly.  You'd have to repave more often, but you have to repave anyway and the tradeoff is that vehicle wheels would almost never wear out.  Potentially might even me more material-efficient, as you wouldn't have all those fabric, fiberglass, and wire tire carcasses to deal with.

[Rick3478 428]

11 minutes ago, squonk said:

I've always thought about adding ground up tires into the pavement mix.

 

I believe they've done some experimenting with that.  And ground up plastic bottles.

 

[Rick3478 428]

1 hour ago, Stormin said:

 

 Be a bit rough off the paved road.

 

Wheels would be much lighter without all that rubber.  Suspension could be tuned much different, maybe not as bad as you might think.

[rmaynard 15,500]

They already pave running tracks at our local high schools with rubber.

[Rick3478 428]

12 minutes ago, Pullstart said:

I would imagine that a rubber road could cause some funky shockwaves if you will, once 40,000+ lbs of momentum multiplied by however many trucks cross through.  If you can visualize the rubber being compressed in a lateral motion, then unraveling it could be detrimental.  I see it like crossing ice at a certain speed (Ice Road Truckers, etc.)

 

Some interesting ideas there.  Roads could be "tuned" to be more efficient at a particular speed, or pavement thickness logarithmically tapered to dampen noise.

[Pullstart 62,905]

15 minutes ago, Rick3478 said:

 

Wheels would be much lighter without all that rubber.  Suspension could be tuned much different, maybe not as bad as you might think.

 

 

[Ed Kennell 38,196]

 

Rubberized asphalt concrete (RAC), also known as asphalt rubber or just rubberized asphalt, is noise reducing pavement material that consists of regular asphalt concrete mixed with crumb rubber made from recycled tires. Asphalt rubber is the largest single market for ground rubber in the United States, consuming an estimated 220,000,000 pounds (100,000,000 kg), or approximately 12 million tires annually.^[1]

Use of rubberized asphalt as a pavement material was pioneered by the city of Phoenix, Arizona in the 1960s because of its high durability.^[2] Since then it has garnered interest for its ability to reduce road noise.

In 2003 the Arizona Department of Transportation began a three-year, $34-million Quiet Pavement Pilot Program, in cooperation with the Federal Highway Administration to determine if sound walls can be replaced by rubberized asphalt to reduce noise alongside highways. After about one year it was determined that asphalt rubber overlays resulted in up to 12 decibels of in road noise reduction, with a typical reduction of 7 to 9 decibels.^[3]

Arizona has been the leader in using rubberized asphalt, but California, Florida, Texas, and South Carolina are also using asphalt rubber. Tests are currently underway in other parts of the United States to determine the durability of rubberized asphalt in northern climates, including a 1.3 mile stretch of Interstate 405 in Bellevue and Kirkland, Washington^[4] and a handful of local roads in the city of Colorado Springs, Colorado. In 2012, the State of Georgia issued a specification for the use of rubber-modified asphalt as a replacement for polymer-modified asphalt. In Belgium, tests in the ring of Brussel and in the F1 circuit of Francorchamp (see the film by Jean-Marie Piquint Rubberized Asphalt for Esso Belgium).^[5][6]

Two quality control requirements are necessary when using asphalt rubber: (a) crumb rubber tends to separate and settle down in the asphalt cement and therefore asphalt rubber needs to be agitated continuously to keep the rubber particles in suspension and (b) crumb rubber is prone to degradation (devulcanization and depolymerization) and thus lose its elasticity if asphalt rubber is maintained at high temperatures for more than 6–8 hours. This means asphalt rubber must be used within 8 hours after production.^[7]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[ri702bill 8,327]

2 hours ago, Pullstart said:

I would imagine that a rubber road could cause some funky shockwaves if you will, once 40,000+ lbs of momentum multiplied by however many trucks cross through.  If you can visualize the rubber being compressed in a lateral motion, then unraveling it could be detrimental.  I see it like crossing ice at a certain speed (Ice Road Truckers, etc.)

We had a disaster of "Road Improvement" in Providence 30 or so years ago "Popcorn Tar" - a rubber / asphalt mix that was touted as a great improvement in water drainage. That it was, EXCEPT it was used on RT95 at the INFAMOUS Thurbers Avenue Curve. Seems that side shear as @Pullstart talked about from 18 wheelers  took the top 3 inches off the road on the first warm day..... Numerous accidents and subsequently, a nighttime repaving to rid that stuff and go back to what works.....

[Achto 27,594]

4 hours ago, squonk said:

I've always thought about adding ground up tires into the pavement mix.

 

https://www.fhwa.dot.gov/pavement/pubs/hif14015.pdf

[Rick3478 428]

8 hours ago, ri702bill said:

We had a disaster of "Road Improvement" in Providence 30 or so years ago "Popcorn Tar" - a rubber / asphalt mix that was touted as a great improvement in water drainage. That it was, EXCEPT it was used on RT95 at the INFAMOUS Thurbers Avenue Curve. Seems that side shear as @Pullstart talked about from 18 wheelers  took the top 3 inches off the road on the first warm day..... Numerous accidents and subsequently, a nighttime repaving to rid that stuff and go back to what works.....

 

Sounds like they needed more heat resistant "glue" in the mix.

 

I've seen related things.  I took old US 30 through PA one time and saw numerous curves with spreading cracks up to an inch wide, where trucks were slowly but surely pushing the whole road off the side of the hill.  I didn't feel safe with even my little pickup truck rig, and took a different route home.

 

And we've all seen the places where trucks stop at traffic lights and push up waves of asphalt over time.

 

So yeah, you'll have a learning curve regardless of material, and adapt as needed.  Develop better mixes, reinforce problem areas with belt or rebar or something, whatever works.

 

I wasn't sure where this thread might lead, and was honestly a bit tongue-in-cheek, but hoped it would stimulate thought.  And it seems some good stuff came out.  I hadn't anticipated the noise reduction aspect, for example.  Imagine quiet roads!

 

[ri702bill 8,327]

1 hour ago, Rick3478 said:

Imagine quiet roads!

Around here, I imagine roads without potholes!! One of the highest road usage taxes, with the worst roads and bridges....

[Ed Kennell 38,196]

1 hour ago, ri702bill said:

highest road usage taxes, with the worst roads and bridges

I think PeeAaa can claim that title.

     STATE                            GASOLINE                   DIESEL                      AVAITION                             JET FUEL

Pennsylvania

$0.611 / gallon

$0.785 / gallon

$0.06 / gallon               $0.02/gallon

Edited May 14, 2023 by Ed Kennell

[CCW 1,295]

13 hours ago, ri702bill said:

We had a disaster of "Road Improvement" in Providence 30 or so years ago "Popcorn Tar" - a rubber / asphalt mix that was touted as a great improvement in water drainage. That it was, EXCEPT it was used on RT95 at the INFAMOUS Thurbers Avenue Curve. Seems that side shear as @Pullstart talked about from 18 wheelers  took the top 3 inches off the road on the first warm day..... Numerous accidents and subsequently, a nighttime repaving to rid that stuff and go back to what works.....

 

Ah I well remember that curve.  Nasty little bugger.

[ztnoo 2,298]

21 hours ago, Stormin said:

Vehicles could then have durable, long lasting

metal, plastic, or ceramic wheels.

 

I have to seriously wonder about adequate coefficient of friction between the road surface and contact points, especially in locales which endure snow, sleet, and freezing rain.......