314H hydro issues

[Dennis C. 142]

I've posted here several times to find solutions for different issues with my 314H.  Overall the tractor is physically in excellent shape but had several mechanical issue from previous owners

abuse. One by one I've correct each issue and now I'm onto the transmission. The tractor sat inactive all winter in my storage shed which was about 7 months. I installed the battery for the first time this season and proceeded to start the engine. I pulled up the cold start lever for the transmission and fired up the engine. After 10 minutes I engaged the cold start lever and the engine stopped immediately.  Each time I tried to re-engage the cold start lever the engine would quit. So i went to 1/2 throttle and slowly engaged the cold start lever, but not fully, until the pump started to turn. Pump was whining rather loudly. After another 10 minute warm up I moved the tractor outside and drove around. Seemed to drive OK. At this point I stopped and did a transmission oil change and filter. The filter appeared to be a Kohler engine filter, not the correct filter. The filter was on so tight I couldn't move it so I didn't change it. I refilled the trans with 10-30 and did my first mowing of the season. While in gear  moving over the ground I notice loud gear noise, especially if I am on uneven terrain or move up slightly uphill. What  should I look for? Is the trans worn out, can it be rebuilt and is the pump any good? Are parts available to fix the trans? Over the past 2 years I have already spent  $900 to fix other issues and at this point I don't want to throw up my hands and quit. Thanks in advance for any help.

[Ed Kennell 38,230]

Does the tractor have the hydraulic lift?   If it does , it has the Eaton 1100 transmission,   one of the best hydros.   I have several of these and never had one fail.    If no lift, it has the Eaton 700...not so good.

 

Two things I would do;

  1. change the filter   even if you have to remove the left wheel and destroy the filter

   2,  check the belt idler /tensionor pulley for a bad bearing.         I have bought several tractors witn "bad transmission" for cheap.     The bad transmissions were a worn out idler pulley.

 

 

Edited May 7, 2023 by Ed Kennell

[squonk 41,158]

700 does not have a filter so it has to be an 1100.

[Dennis C. 142]

59 minutes ago, Ed Kennell said:

Does the tractor have the hydraulic lift?   If it does , it has the Eaton 1100 transmission,   one of the best hydros.   I have several of these and never had one fail.    If no lift, it has the Eaton 700...not so good.

 

Two things I would do;

  1. change the filter   even if you have to remove the left wheel and destroy the filter

   2,  check the belt idler /tensionor pulley for a bad bearing.         I have bought several tractors witn "bad transmission" for cheap.     The bad transmissions were a worn out idler pulley.

 

 

Yes this is a Eaton 1100. I not so worried about removing the filter as I am the loud gear noise. Sounds like something grinding.

[squonk 41,158]

I would get that filter off and cut it open to see if there are metal particles in it. You may find your answer.

[Dennis C. 142]

1 minute ago, squonk said:

I would get that filter off and cut it open to see if there are metal particles in it. You may find your answer.

I guess I'll have to do that. Can you still get parts for that transmission? I did find a used one for sale in my home state for $200

but it's off a 1994 416H. Is that the same transmission I have?

[squonk 41,158]

1 hour ago, Dennis C. said:

I guess I'll have to do that. Can you still get parts for that transmission? I did find a used one for sale in my home state for $200

but it's off a 1994 416H. Is that the same transmission I have?

You probably would be better off getting the used trans. I had a bad 1100 years ago. The hydro part was a pain to get off the tractor. It was really stuck. Just the hydro part of it is available on ebay ect. I gave up trying to get it apart and just replaced the whole thing. Note: They are heavy! You will need help or at least get a good motorcycle jack to handle the transmission

Edited May 7, 2023 by squonk

[Dennis C. 142]

5 minutes ago, squonk said:

You probably would be better off getting the used trans. I had a bad 100 years ago. The hydro part was a pain to get off the tractor. It was really stuck. Just the hydro part of it is available on ebay ect. I gave up trying to get it apart and just replaced the whole thing. Note: They are heavy! You will need help or at least get a good motorcycle jack to handle the transmission

Thanks. I make  buy the the transmission just  to have the spare. I'm 73, I'll have to find someone to give me a hand.

[jamessparks 55]

My 95 314H has the clutch disengage lever that as Ed mentioned works off the spring to the idler pulley. This itself makes a lot of noise and possibly what your hearing? 

[Dennis C. 142]

11 hours ago, jamessparks said:

My 95 314H has the clutch disengage lever that as Ed mentioned works off the spring to the idler pulley. This itself makes a lot of noise and possibly what your hearing? 

Mine has the same set up and I replaced the pulley last year. The noise is gear noise but only after the tractor has run for a while.

[kpinnc 12,099]

4 hours ago, Dennis C. said:

Mine has the same set up and I replaced the pulley last year. The noise is gear noise but only after the tractor has run for a while.

 

I would think you should only ever have two noises from your machine's transmission: the familiar (light in most cases) whine of the hydro, or the rattle of the linkages on the engagement lever/ pulley combo.

 

You can safely (if inclined to do so) remove all the rattling parts on the disengagement lever, and just install the spring to keep tension on the pulley swingarm. None of the later Eaton 1100 machines used that system. It was simply the spring and swingarm keeping tension on the pulley. 

 

If your transmission makes grinding sounds, you definitely don't want to run it without finding out why. Even if the filter is free of debris, you may have a broken differential bolt rattling around, which can break many more parts. 

Edited May 9, 2023 by kpinnc

[Handy Don 12,237]

34 minutes ago, kpinnc said:

which can break many more parts

Plus take a lot of time and effort.

[Dennis C. 142]

29 minutes ago, kpinnc said:

 

I would think you should only ever have two noises from your machine's transmission: the familiar (light in most cases) whine of the hydro, or the rattle of the linkages on the engagement lever/ pulley combo.

 

You can safely (if inclined to do so) remove all the rattling parts on the disengagement lever, and just install the spring to keep tension on the pulley swingarm. None of the later Eaton 1100 machines used that system. It was simply the spring and swingarm keeping tension on the pulley. 

 

If your transmission makes grinding sounds, you definitely don't want to run it without finding out why. Even if the filter is free of debris, you may have a broken differential bolt rattling around, which can break many more parts. 

As I mentioned earlier, the cold start pulley is new last year, or as you refer engagement pulley for the belt. Those noises I have isolated.  The hydro pump whines, yes but when the tractor sat over the winter the pump would not turn over. Every time time I engaged the belt pulley the engine would quit. I finally had to go to 1/2 throttle and "feather" the engagement pulley until the pump turned freely. Oil level was full. The noise I hear from the transmission is only after I have mowed for a while. When cold, the transmission is silent. Describing "noises" is not easy. I would say the noise a loud gear whine and more persistent when turning or traveling over uneven ground. Dismantling this transmission is above my pay grade. I don't have the strength or the knowledge. There is no one in my area that works on this old stuff.

[Handy Don 12,237]

4 minutes ago, Dennis C. said:

Describing "noises" is not easy

Do you have the wherewithal (or an assistant) to record a video of the noise that you can post here?

Since you are not a supporter and have limits on posting images and videos, the easiest way is probably via posting the video to YouTube and then creating a post with a link to the video here on the forum.

[Dennis C. 142]

55 minutes ago, Handy Don said:

Do you have the wherewithal (or an assistant) to record a video of the noise that you can post here?

Since you are not a supporter and have limits on posting images and videos, the easiest way is probably via posting the video to YouTube and then creating a post with a link to the video here on the forum.

Unfortunately I'm not a up to date guy with technology.  It's very doubtful i could get a good video with sound. My best bet would be a Wheel Horse guy with good knowledge of what's normal noise and what isn't.  

[kpinnc 12,099]

3 hours ago, Dennis C. said:

I don't have the strength or the knowledge. There is no one in my area that works on this old stuff.

 

The Eatons are very simple to dig into- so far as the transaxle (main gearbox) is concerned. The pump sits on top of it. But the main gearbox can be opened fairly easy. It only has a few solid shaft reduction gears in it. 

 

But it's best to check the filter first. Hopefully its just something in a bind that can be corrected. I've seen a diff bolt loosen and contact the case, which locks the tranny down and can break the case depending on the speed when it catches. 

Edited May 9, 2023 by kpinnc

[Dennis C. 142]

16 hours ago, kpinnc said:

 

The Eatons are very simple to dig into- so far as the transaxle (main gearbox) is concerned. The pump sits on top of it. But the main gearbox can be opened fairly easy. It only has a few solid shaft reduction gears in it. 

 

But it's best to check the filter first. Hopefully its just something in a bind that can be corrected. I've seen a diff bolt loosen and contact the case, which locks the tranny down and can break the case depending on the speed when it catches. 

I've got some health issues to deal with first before I can dismantle the trans. I don't have access to a hoist or the like.   At some point I'll drain the oil again and filter it for metal shavings. Then I'll try to remove the filter and cut it open.  I'm 73 and projects move slowly these days.

[oliver2-44 9,761]

Before you completely remove the transaxle let us know. Theirs a way to remove one wheel hub and pull narrower side of the gearbox in place. Potentially a lot less work and no heavy lifting. But more work sitting, laying on the floor. 
some of the guys here could walk you through how to do that. 

Edited May 12, 2023 by oliver2-44

[Dennis C. 142]

42 minutes ago, oliver2-44 said:

Before you completely remove the transaxle let us know. Theirs a way to remove one wheel hub and pull narrower side of the gearbox in place. Potentially a lot less work and no heavy lifting. But more work sitting, laying on the floor. 
some of the guys here could walk you through how to do that. 

Thanks for the info. I don't think the problem is as bad as I make it. But I am concerned. This tractor is really in amazing shape. I have the skills to tackle the job, not the strength. I had to pull the engine out of this thing by hand 2 years ago and that was a project. Thanks again.

[squonk 41,158]

1 hour ago, oliver2-44 said:

Before you completely remove the transaxle let us know. Theirs a way to remove one wheel hub and pull narrower side of the gearbox in place. Potentially a lot less work and no heavy lifting. But more work sitting, laying on the floor. 
some of the guys here could walk you through how to do that. 

I'm thinking the problem in in the pump and not the gear box. Remember this is an Eaton 1100. Entire hydro is contained in one piece. 4 bolts, fan, pulley and the lines. I tried to remove one once and it was stuck good to the transmission. I had to remove the whole unit before I could break it loose.

 

 

 

[Dennis C. 142]

I was able to remove the old transmission filter which was actual an Kohler engine filter! Installed the correct filter and this time i refilled the trans with10W40 instead. Transmission is operating much better with the correct filter and the heavier oil. Now to use the mower for a while and see how well it operates. Thanks for all the info and help.