Dozer Blade Spring Ends Coming Off

[Handy Don 12,178]

6 minutes ago, Pullstart said:

Not necessarily wedging the coils open, but in essence rebuilding the threads the way they were (assuming they are worn).  Shape the end of the roll pin sticking out of the cast into a proud V and become the new threads.  Then, spin the spring back on.

Ah, I think I see. Drill the holes in the “ridge" of the threads and then use small pins and have them just proud of the thread wedging tightly into the “vee” between spring coils?

[Sailman 1,291]

Sounds like either the shims or roll pins might be a solution assuming the metal integrity is still there (not too rusted or corroded). I would add a dollop of JB Weld to either fix to get close to the original strength without the risk involved in welding the joint.

[Blasterdad 2,691]

[Handy Don 12,178]

23 hours ago, Blasterdad said:

Interesting. Idea is to try to squeeze the spring against the cast endpiece, right?

[Handy Don 12,178]

On 3/1/2023 at 9:13 AM, Sailman said:

Sounds like either the shims or roll pins might be a solution assuming the metal integrity is still there (not too rusted or corroded). I would add a dollop of JB Weld to either fix to get close to the original strength without the risk involved in welding the joint.

Leaning toward cleaning up all the parts and then gently peening four or five thin shim strips to conform to the end piece thread, JB welding them on, and then rethreading the end into the spring.

Drilling the end casting and having the loading be concentrated on the roll pins seems too risky for my comfort.

[peter lena 8,589]

@Handy Don never had a spring issue , but while you are in the area , an elevated , off the floor look at and detail function on the STEERING QUADRANT , will make it swing / slide and spring lever engage the squeeze lever . like red aerosil grase , that slide pin will work like a rifle bolt . using small channel locks , tighten up the starting lever top rod to lever sloppy play . lubricate as you go , also add longer bolts to lever points , and elastic lock nuts , so you can dial in function and hold it with the lock nut . eliminate sloppy / play , lube / test . pete  

[Handy Don 12,178]

2 minutes ago, peter lena said:

@Handy Don never had a spring issue , but while you are in the area , an elevated , off the floor look at and detail function on the STEERING QUADRANT , will make it swing / slide and spring lever engage the squeeze lever . like red aerosil grase , that slide pin will work like a rifle bolt . using small channel locks , tighten up the starting lever top rod to lever sloppy play . lubricate as you go , also add longer bolts to lever points , and elastic lock nuts , so you can dial in function and hold it with the lock nut . eliminate sloppy / play , lube / test . pete  

Did most of this in the fall and covered in another thread. Yep, aerosol red is right handy!

All other aspects of the plow are just fine, especially with the alignment guide rod added based on a design from @Ed Kennell. Nylock for the pivot lever bolt was not so easy to find, though!

[lynnmor 7,302]

14 minutes ago, Handy Don said:

Interesting. Idea is to try to squeeze the spring against the cast endpiece, right?

I think he is on to something there.  Since the product shown is thin it might yield and not help much, so my thought is to press a thick walled ring in place after assembly.

[Handy Don 12,178]

13 minutes ago, lynnmor said:

I think he is on to something there.  Since the product shown is thin it might yield and not help much, so my thought is to press a thick walled ring in place after assembly.

I can see this, but any “squeezer” would be trying to compress several coils of a very strong, thick-wire spring--not just at installation, but for its full working life.

I’m fairly convinced the right path is to enlarge the end piece's threaded section to offset material loss caused by rust and wear there and on the inside of the spring coil--kinda an inverse HeliCoil or changing to a “10 over" piston. If this fails, replace the entire assembly.

Edited March 2, 2023 by Handy Don

[Ed Kennell 38,050]

       More options, but $$$

[lynnmor 7,302]

1 minute ago, Handy Don said:

I can see this, but any “squeezer” would be trying to compress several coils of a very strong, thick-wire spring--not just at installation, but for its full working life.

I’m fairly convinced the right path is to enlarge the end piece's threaded section to offset material loss through rust and wear there and on the inside of the spring coil--kinda an inverse HeliCoil. If this fails, replace the entire assembly.

Since the spring was retained till extreme force pulled it off, all that is needed is to prevent expansion, the press fit doesn't need to compress much, just hold the ring in place.  My only concern is that rust would be accelerated since cleaning would be difficult.

[Blasterdad 2,691]

I wasn't suggesting that perticular clamp before, just one with a wider / stronger grip than a hose clamp, this style is even thicker.

Just my Idea...

 

[Blasterdad 2,691]

I've seen where someone used longer spring rods & put 2 springs on each side, I searched for a pic but can't find it.

[Ed Kennell 38,050]

26 minutes ago, Blasterdad said:

I've seen where someone used longer spring rods & put 2 springs on each side, I searched for a pic but can't find it.

I've seen that also, but felt that defeats the safety function of the blade trip design.    My blade trips quite often as I use my blade for a lot of dozer work including trail work where I am catching on roots.    I am thankful the blade does trip fairly easily so I can do the work without fear of damaging the equipment.

 

Edited March 2, 2023 by Ed Kennell

[Handy Don 12,178]

2 hours ago, Ed Kennell said:

I've seen that also, but felt that defeats the safety function of the blade trip design.    My blade trips quite often as I use my blade for a lot of dozer work including trail work where I am catching on roots.    I am thankful the blade does trip fairly easily so I can do the work without fear of damaging the equipment.

 

Exactly. I have no problem backing up and then going forward again! 

@ebinmaine mentioned replacing with aftermarket that have a perpendicular loop of the coil as the attachment. I did some research and decided no for now. Too costly, no way to compare the force/displacement with the WH items, and would need to re-think the mounting to handle point loading at the ends (vs. the sleeves of the WH system). 

 

2 hours ago, Blasterdad said:

I wasn't suggesting that perticular clamp before, just one with a wider / stronger grip than a hose clamp, this style is even thicker.

Just my Idea...

 

A spring’s diameter gets smaller when it’s stretched. (Remember those finger handcuffs we had when we were kids?)

 

In my mind, if the current components are not mating tightly enough when the spring gets stretched then a clamp would have to both shrink the starting diameter of the spring AND not loosen when the spring gets stretched. Not a trivial (or cheap to solve) mechanical accomplishment.

 

Clamping an exhaust pipe where the clamp can prevent thermal expansion (or allow only some as it itself expands) is a different ballgame.

[Ed Kennell 38,050]

Just thinking how I might fasten a spring if one of mine becomes loose.

[Handy Don 12,178]

2 minutes ago, Ed Kennell said:

Just thinking how I might fasten a spring if one of mine becomes loose.

 

That is intriguing, Ed. Completely separate spring retention clamps. Some challenges to permit plow tipping freedom (though both ends on the same shaft could be locked to the shaft and rotate together). Need it at all four ends.

Some additional thoughts?

[ebinmaine 67,335]

35 minutes ago, Handy Don said:

need to re-think the mounting to handle point loading at the ends

The one I remember had the ½" rods used so the springs went around the rods. 

No mounting changes were necessary.  

The springs though.... I don't have the foggiest idea how they were chosen.