Do You Need To Add Zinc To Your Oil?

[Achto 27,570]

49 minutes ago, Brockport Bill said:

 

 

Soo...Is this oil formulated for their new over head valve engines or their old flat head engines??? It says Kohler warranty approved, but I'm quite sure that they will not warranty any of the old flat head engines any more. I'm quite sure that they could care less about what happens to the old engines. They keep the doors open by selling new engines. Not trying to be a "Jack Wagon", just throwing thoughts out there. 

 

Presumably all new oils are superior to the old oils, so we are probably in good shape with most oils & regular oil changes. 

Edited February 16, 2023 by Achto

[Sailman 1,291]

I don't think there is any dispute that the older Kohlers were meant to be run with zinc in the oil. I run Rotella in my diesels but stick with the OEM SAE 30 with zinc from Kohler for the wheel horses. Makes it real simple. No issue with not enough or too much zinc.

But that's just me 

Edited February 16, 2023 by Sailman

[Achto 27,570]

Well we are here beating the heck out of this horse. Lets get some learning on multi grade vs strait weight oil.

 

https://www.google.com/search?q=strait+and+multi+weight+oil+comparison&sxsrf=AJOqlzUgkFtcruql5a0iN3TykMk9P3bY4Q:1676591063882&source=lnms&tbm=vid&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjD_a62nJv9AhV8lIkEHc9ZBQUQ_AUoA3oECAEQBQ&biw=1536&bih=754&dpr=1.25#fpstate=ive&vld=cid:ef5e6b05,vid:Z-OpTjtSoeQ

[lynnmor 7,305]

1 hour ago, Brockport Bill said:

i clicked on your link and it comes up 10w 30 Kohler oil -  not 30w with zinc added - - so i did search in their search field and nothing comes up for 30w - - are you referring to the 10w30 being half the price as 30 w - did they ship to you or was it picked up in their Indiana store? thanks

Try this.  They shipped it to me, I don't remember the shipping cost, they didn't charge tax.

 

Kohler oil can be priced at all kinds of crazy levels, shop around.  All motor oil contains zinc so saying zinc added doesn't mean much, finding oil with the correct level is the goal.  Oil doesn't care where the valves are, anti-wear additives prevent wear.  The only reason that ZDDP was reduced was to protect emissions systems and more wear was the result.  I believe that Kohler recommends 10W-30 for newer engines and that is why that grade exists..

[JCM 9,158]

6 hours ago, Racinbob said:

 One thing I won't do is switch from the lubricating products that have never failed me for decades.  I'm thinking it would be a good idea but then my thoughts go to the "why mess with something that has always worked?" logic.          

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[lynnmor 7,305]

11 minutes ago, JCM said:

 

6 hours ago, Racinbob said:

 One thing I won't do is switch from the lubricating products that have never failed me for decades.  I'm thinking it would be a good idea but then my thoughts go to the "why mess with something that has always worked?" logic.          

 

Today's oil isn't your fathers oil, the powers that be have monkeyed with it just like they did with the fuel.  You need to recognize that things have changed and there is no way to find yesterdays product.

[ebinmaine 67,464]

1 hour ago, c-series don said:

@ebinmaineI’m very good friends with the guys that own my local Carquest Auto Parts store so I’ve been using Carquest oil. I’m actually not sure who makes it though? But I’m going to find out! 

 

The concern I'd have with the Carquest oil is that it's likely made for newer specs.  

 

Oils with proper zddp have an SAE  rating back in the range of SJ or so.  

 

 

 

[Brockport Bill 1,661]

1 hour ago, Achto said:

 

 

Soo...Is this oil formulated for their new over head valve engines or their old flat head engines??? It says Kohler warranty approved, but I'm quite sure that they will not warranty any of the old flat head engines any more. I'm quite sure that they could care less about what happens to the old engines. They keep the doors open by selling new engines. Not trying to be a "Jack Wagon", just throwing thoughts out there. 

 

Presumably all new oils are superior to the old oils, so we are probably in good shape with most oils & regular oil changes. 

don't recall exactly when and where i read it ? It was in recent months when we had all the RSq discussion about zinc - - I recall Kohler stated  they specifically developed their "zinc oil" for their older engines because of those engines needs --- i'm just assuming they know their market and that there are many older Kohler engines in use - lots of Kohler folks out there????????????

[Racinbob 11,075]

34 minutes ago, lynnmor said:

Today's oil isn't your fathers oil, the powers that be have monkeyed with it just like they did with the fuel.  You need to recognize that things have changed and there is no way to find yesterdays product.

 

Oh I'm very well aware of that. The top go juice companies have kept up very well. I wouldn't use yesterdays oils nowadays. As the comments keep coming in I'm just getting more inclined to not try to fix something that has never been a problem for me. 

[c-series don 8,701]

@Racinbob I’m with you on that! I’ve yet to blow up one of my engines or cause unnecessary damage that I’m aware of. For years I used Kendall oil until my auto parts guy stopped carrying it. Then I switched to their brand and haven’t had any problems. If anything I may change oil too often! My Work Horse GT-1800 I bought brand new and never did anything to the engine but change the oil a lot. I never put additives in the oil or worried if it had zinc or anything else in it. It’s still going strong. That being said I hope I didn’t just jinx myself so I’ll shut up now!! 

[ebinmaine 67,464]

2 minutes ago, c-series don said:

change oil

I think that's a key.  

[JCM 9,158]

30 minutes ago, c-series don said:

If anything I may change oil too often! My Work Horse GT-1800 I bought brand new and never did anything to the engine but change the oil a lot. I never put additives in the oil or worried if it had zinc or anything else in it. It’s still going strong.        

 

[JCM 9,158]

Since 1989 Valvoline 10-30 year round since new. 2023 Valvoline 10-30 changed every 15 to 25 hours. No smoke, no oil usage. that's my story and I'm sticking to it. 

[Bill D 1,920]

In my opinion modern spec synthetic oil is superior to 40 year dino juice.  According to the Mobil 1 website their Mobil 1 Full Synthetic 10W-30 High Mileage formula has 900 ppm of zinc.  That, coupled with the superior lubricating properties of synthetic oil, and the relatively low valve spring pressures compared to automotive engines, should make their oil more than suitable for our needs without risking major camshaft or bearing damage.  If you absolutely have to have an SJ rated oil, Amsoil's ZRod oil is a true SJ/SL rated synthetic oil.  

[ebinmaine 67,464]

45 minutes ago, Bill D said:

In my opinion modern spec synthetic oil is superior to 40 year dino juice.  According to the Mobil 1 website their Mobil 1 Full Synthetic 10W-30 High Mileage formula has 900 ppm of zinc.  That, coupled with the superior lubricating properties of synthetic oil, and the relatively low valve spring pressures compared to automotive engines, should make their oil more than suitable for our needs without risking major camshaft or bearing damage.  If you absolutely have to have an SJ rated oil, Amsoil's ZRod oil is a true SJ/SL rated synthetic oil.  

 

I have a friend that is a firm believer in using Mobil 1 synthetic whenever possible.

I certainly don't disagree in principle but at twice the price I'm too frugal to buy it. 

 

 

[EB-80/8inPA 1,641]

 

38 minutes ago, ebinmaine said:

 

I have a friend that is a firm believer in using Mobil 1 synthetic whenever possible.

I certainly don't disagree in principle but at twice the price I'm too frugal to buy it. 

 

 

Speaking of Mobil 1, wasn’t there a thread on here awhile back in which the poster said that Wally World super tech oil came from the same refinery as Mobil-1 and that they’re actually the same exact thing?  Or am I having a senior moment?

[Bill D 1,920]

52 minutes ago, ebinmaine said:

 

I have a friend that is a firm believer in using Mobil 1 synthetic whenever possible.

I certainly don't disagree in principle but at twice the price I'm too frugal to buy it. 

 

 

My local BJ's had Mobil 1 5W-30 Full Synthetic High Mileage on sale recently for $32 for six quarts. I decided to start using it in my Jeep.  I'm hopeful they'll start stocking 10W-30.

[John c 79]

I use the power care brand SJ rated sae 30wt in my older OPE without issue, 2 L head briggs, a Tecumseh, and the kolher in the 314-8.

 

I have a late model briggs on a JD ZTR and the JD brand oil is rated at SN, which as I understand it is no zinc at all because of damage to catalytic converter in automobiles. 

 

so the SN rated oil would be a definite no-go in the older flat head engines........correct ? But I wonder if the SJ would do harm to the newer OHV briggs.

 

opinions ...

[lynnmor 7,305]

7 hours ago, John c said:

I use the power care brand SJ rated sae 30wt in my older OPE without issue, 2 L head briggs, a Tecumseh, and the kolher in the 314-8.

 

I have a late model briggs on a JD ZTR and the JD brand oil is rated at SN, which as I understand it is no zinc at all because of damage to catalytic converter in automobiles. 

 

so the SN rated oil would be a definite no-go in the older flat head engines........correct ? But I wonder if the SJ would do harm to the newer OHV briggs.

 

opinions ...

JD 30 wt oil has ZDDP,, most oils do contain some.  SN oils have a reduced amount, but you can still buy other oil with the correct amount and some are found in this thread.  ZDDP is an anti-wear additive that has been used for at least 3/4 of a century, it reduces wear in any four cycle engine no matter how they are designed.  Yes, you can use most any oil, just know that you can select one that may be better.  The Power Care brand might be fine, just find the amount of ZDDP.

[peter lena 8,623]

@Achto  responding to your multiweight oil  learning curve, when tried a 10-30 oil  noticed the slower warm up , some smoke , when using a 5-30  oil , there was zero effect to the cold start , oil heat up was quicker and , no effect at all to it converting to the heavier 30 wt rating . was using castrol , magnatec oil . engines really like it over winter , cold starts . have often experimented with many lubricants , and regularly check them for effects , how they are doing . my testing with the lucas 80-90 climbing gear lube is very good , hours and road miles on it .  like the sticky clinging lubricant effects , easier shifting , using every gear / range . quieter too. did all 3 of mine , always experimenting with function , another thing with oils , is getting them hot to work , very important in cold weather , oils look more stable and effective . just my experience , pete 

[Jeff-C175 7,202]

On 2/17/2023 at 3:24 PM, EB-80/8inPA said:

 

Speaking of Mobil 1, wasn’t there a thread on here awhile back in which the poster said that Wally World super tech oil came from the same refinery as Mobil-1 and that they’re actually the same exact thing?  Or am I having a senior moment?

 

Might have been me.  I read that somewhere and did a little research to verify and from what I could tell, it is so.

 

 

[peter lena 8,623]

@Jeff-C175  my son has a 32-8 horse in vermont , has always used mobil-1 from the start , going on 23 years , no oil issues at all , regularly looks it over for anything , if he has an issue , gives me a shout , he also services his vehicles , motorcycle . pete