KT 17 Engine oil for C175 Kohler ???

[953 nut 55,284]

When I lived in Florida I put in a lot of hours mowing my lawn at ambient temperatures well over 90 degrees Fahrenheit without any oil problems. This Kohler M Twin (same as KT except the ignition) manual shows the temperature range to be 32 to over 100 degrees Fahrenheit tor 30 weight.

[Brockport Bill 1,667]

yes -- my plan is to use the 5w or 10w for winter..... and the straight 30w starting early summer oil change for warmer outdoors temps -- the original issue i asked about was more about the alpha designations of the API and of SG, SH, Sn etc - gotten some feedback on the alphas, but that's the info I am still seeking to learn more about ? Thanks

[Brockport Bill 1,667]

when i started this thread i was wondering about the alpha designations for oil to be used in the older Kohler engines - in my case the KT 17 in C175's  - - so i asked the brain trust here for insights  -- i also wrote email to FRAM - here is their response -- i hope you find it insightful -- especially to those who comment about the ZINC issue !!!!

We appreciate you contacting us regarding the FRAM-branded lubricants we manufacture on behalf of Advance/Carquest Auto Parts. The American Petroleum Institute designations define the performance requirements of a specific oil. For instance, API SG oils were designed for use in gasoline engines built before 1993. The current API standard for gasoline-powered engines is API SP. The API SP oils are formulated to protect modern engines while also having backward compatibility with older engines. I recommend using the FRAM 30W Engine Oil with a supplemental ZDDP additive, as modern oils contain less ZDDP than older formulations.

 

[SylvanLakeWH 25,596]

19 hours ago, pfrederi said:

I hate oil discussions.... If you are using your WH in a business with several hours a day every day then maybe the type of oil makes big difference.  For most of us with 50 hours or so a year changing the oil is much more important than what type of oil you use.

 

 

I'm about 15-20 hrs a year. Change it annually. FWIW I use Rotella T1 30 year round. No issues. 

[Brockport Bill 1,667]

1 hour ago, SylvanLakeWH said:

 

 

I'm about 15-20 hrs a year. Change it annually. FWIW I use Rotella T1 30 year round. No issues. 

so then your comfortable using the 30w in Michigan winter temps even tho its recommended only above 30 F ?? thanks for insights

[SylvanLakeWH 25,596]

55 minutes ago, Brockport Bill said:

so then your comfortable using the 30w in Michigan winter temps even tho its recommended only above 30 F ?? thanks for insights

 

Yep.

[Jeff-C175 7,202]

1 hour ago, Brockport Bill said:

so then your comfortable using the 30w in Michigan winter temps even tho its recommended only above 30 F ?? thanks for insights

 

I believe it has to do mostly with cold starting, since once the engine has been running a few minutes that oil is going to be pretty warm anyway.

 

When cold, the thinking is I believe, that the initial start up may not get the lubrication the engine needs since the oil is thicker.  The KT17 doesn't 'exactly' use full pressure lubrication as you've seen in the earlier graphics posted by others.  It should still be better than the fully splash lubricated K series though.

 

That said, I use the T1 30W year round also, but if there's a storm on it's way and it's very cold out, I place these:

 

 

under the machines to pre-warm the engines a little bit.  Don't know if it really helps, but I do it anyway.

 

 

[Brockport Bill 1,667]

12 minutes ago, Jeff-C175 said:

 

I believe it has to do mostly with cold starting, since once the engine has been running a few minutes that oil is going to be pretty warm anyway.

 

When cold, the thinking is I believe, that the initial start up may not get the lubrication the engine needs since the oil is thicker.  The KT17 doesn't 'exactly' use full pressure lubrication as you've seen in the earlier graphics posted by others.  It should still be better than the fully splash lubricated K series though.

 

That said, I use the T1 30W year round also, but if there's a storm on it's way and it's very cold out, I place these:

 

 

under the machines to pre-warm the engines a little bit.  Don't know if it really helps, but I do it anyway.

 

 

makes sense to me -- or a little spece heater?

[Jeff-C175 7,202]

14 minutes ago, Brockport Bill said:

makes sense to me -- or a little spece heater?

 

Sure... there are also these little 'pads' that you can get :

 

https://www.amazon.com/KENUOS-Thermostat-Self-Adhesive-Dipstick-Silicone/dp/B0B9GWGDPT

 

not sure how 'junky' they are though, or why the description says "Dipstick" ?

 

 

Edited December 13, 2022 by Jeff-C175

[Brockport Bill 1,667]

well aren't they spiffy - guy who invented them probably living in a beach house retired .

[Jeff-C175 7,202]

1 minute ago, Brockport Bill said:

well aren't they spiffy - guy who invented them probably living in a beach house retired .

 

Hee hee... in China !  

 

 

Edited December 13, 2022 by Jeff-C175

[Brockport Bill 1,667]

yeah - China -- not sure if i should laugh or cry?

[953 nut 55,284]

5 hours ago, Brockport Bill said:

yes -- my plan is to use the 5w or 10w for winter..... and the straight 30w starting early summer oil change for warmer outdoors temps -- the original issue i asked about was more about the alpha designations of the API and of SG, SH, Sn etc - gotten some feedback on the alphas, but that's the info I am still seeking to learn more about ? Thanks

It is your engine and you have enough information to make a decision but I would suggest you go with 5W30 or 10W30 rather than straight 5W or 10W. As your engine heats up you want the viscosity of the oil to increase. 

[Brockport Bill 1,667]

thats the plan.......... thanks

[Brockport Bill 1,667]

love the expertise here

[Snoopy11 5,714]

Late to the thread... but I'll throw my quarters at this...

 

I build engines, both those that never see above 3,600 RPM, and some that see 7-9 thousand RPM. In every one of those engines, I run 10w-30 Mobil 1 Synthetic high mileage formula.

 

If you talk to small engine racing corporations, that is what they run and recommend.

 

Those are just splash lubricated engines.

 

In engines that have oil pumps... cold weather can have DRASTIC difference when you use straight 30w as opposed to 10w30.

 

I run 10w-30 in all of my machines. Every. Last. One.

 

Never had a problem.

 

Don

 

 

[Bill D 1,922]

4 hours ago, Snoopy11 said:

Late to the thread... but I'll throw my quarters at this...

 

I build engines, both those that never see above 3,600 RPM, and some that see 7-9 thousand RPM. In every one of those engines, I run 10w-30 Mobil 1 Synthetic high mileage formula.

 

If you talk to small engine racing corporations, that is what they run and recommend.

 

Those are just splash lubricated engines.

 

In engines that have oil pumps... cold weather can have DRASTIC difference when you use straight 30w as opposed to 10w30.

 

I run 10w-30 in all of my machines. Every. Last. One.

 

Never had a problem.

 

Don

 

 

That's probably going to be my go too oil as well.  My local BJ'S carries it.  It's reasonably priced for synthetic at $7/quart.  Based on the numbers I've seen it has about the same amount of zinc in it as Amsoil's small engine formulation.  Like I said, I can always add some extra zinc to it.  The next best choice for synthetic 10W-30 with the proper amount of zinc is Amsoil's ZRod formula at $15/quart.  Amsoil makes excellent products, but I do have a budget.

[Snoopy11 5,714]

11 hours ago, Bill D said:

That's probably going to be my go too oil as well.  My local BJ'S carries it.  It's reasonably priced for synthetic at $7/quart.  Based on the numbers I've seen it has about the same amount of zinc in it as Amsoil's small engine formulation.  Like I said, I can always add some extra zinc to it.  The next best choice for synthetic 10W-30 with the proper amount of zinc is Amsoil's ZRod formula at $15/quart.  Amsoil makes excellent products, but I do have a budget.

I run 10w-30 Royal Purple Racing oil in the blue Ranger... and I do add ZDDP from Lucas to that oil (ZDDP level still not sufficient even with RP).

 

Don

[peter lena 8,632]

@Snoopy11   been a few years now  since regularly using rislone , zink to my engines , there is no smoking at all , oil changes look like hot coal oil , engines run with a very quiet smoothness. because I  regularly keep in touch with my kohlers , can quickly spot or sense any issue . a very good spot to detail in is the carb and related cable connections .  basically  eliminating  sloppy play . found the smallest setting change , to be the deal . for effective response , double fuel filters , regularly use ethenol  regular gas with no issues , but also add  STA BIL  to every bit of my fuel . starting / running has been very solid , just like detailing in anything , making it just a little better . using castrol  5-30 magnatech over winter , no cold starting issues at all , rotella 30 wt  rest of year . also regularly use an old style incandescent  rough service bulb and reflector , up against the center frame lower hitch mount spot , perfect rising heat to engine bottom , battery tender plugged in , instant starts .  have a good Christmas , pete 

[Brockport Bill 1,667]

update: i have been living many new chapters in search for a winter "zinc" engine oil -- ( also eventually a summer synthetic zinc as well ) to get the answers to the ZDDP and Zinc issue from when i began this thread --- and visiting various auto stores, plus Tractor Supply... Harbor Freight - Home Depot etc -- and reading dozens of oil can labels as well as doing many google searches -- also read many of the past R.SQ.  threads -- then today found a very helpful Napa store employee who went to back room dusty shelves and also looked up some catalogues -- where he steered me to a Valvoline racing oil --- that sent me tonight to amazon and located the link below to Valvoline racing oil of a full synthetic with zinc -- called VR 1 which is 10w30 -- its even modestly priced per quart -- ( 6 pack at $60 ) !!!!

https://www.amazon.com/Valvoline-10W-30-Synthetic-Racing-Motor/dp/B006NT84P0/ref=sr_1_2?crid=3OHYNPARNZWTG&keywords=valvoline%2Bvr1%2B10w30%2Bhigh%2Bzinc&qid=1671586395&s=automotive&sprefix=valvoline%2Bvr1%2B10w30%2Cautomotive%2C92&sr=1-2&th=1

 

I also found Kohler full synthetic oil with Zinc added ( actually prominantly listed on front label ) at Tractor Supply -- but more expensive https://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/product/kohler-10w-30-premium-oil-1-qt?cm_vc=-10005

 

the Kohler is widely available from 7-8 dollars up to 13 per qt.

 

i have not been able to find the ppm spec for either but i am guessing somone will -- any continued advice is appreciated

 

 

[Jeff-C175 7,202]

1 hour ago, Brockport Bill said:

find the ppm spec

 

https://images.carid.com/valvoline/pdf/vr1-racing-oil.pdf

 

Not sure what this is in terms of PPM though, and there's no explanation of the units used that I can find

 

[Jeff-C175 7,202]

I've been hearing good things about the Quaker State Full Synthetic lately... not sure if the hype is reality though.

 

https://www.walmart.com/ip/Quaker-State-Full-Synthetic-10W-30-Motor-Oil-5-Quart/193552982

 

 

[Brockport Bill 1,667]

2 minutes ago, Jeff-C175 said:

 

https://images.carid.com/valvoline/pdf/vr1-racing-oil.pdf

 

Not sure what this is in terms of PPM though, and there's no explanation of the units used that I can find

 

Jeff - these geeks at these companies dont make it easy for us common folk not accustomed to technical spec sheets --  i  am guessing it means 1400 ppm of zinc... and 1300 ppm for phosphorus. I have searched all over online to find Kohler oil specs but finally gave up and sent message email to kohler customer service to ask them?????????