Let me get yalls opinion repower vs original

[RED-Z06 2,379]

So i have a tractor...i bought it this year and restored it, only to have the 20hp onan break 45 minutes later on the first use (seller hid a problem) and the only shop that would touch it (needs the seat pocket welded, machined, and a new seat put in) is 9 months into ignoring it so...ive pretty well given up hope there.  I have found a company that has a correct P220 Onan, that they say ran with no smoke but had a noisy starter/ring gear...for $500 shipped.  That's not alot of money...but i know going in, im going to have to swap the starter, flywheel, and do the governor spacer swap inside to the steel unit, and still have the risk of seat failure because thats just what P220's do.

 

On the other side...i have a company that says they will hopefully soon have new stock of a 23hp Vanguard that has the correct flywheel adapter, pto adapter for the clutch, proper wiring harness, and a plate on the bottom to lift it to the proper height...its a bolt on complete engine..but its $2,200 shipped with Tax.

 

I love the sound and feel of the onan...i really do, but i hate working on them because it seems like their more common failures are catastrophic (seat failure, starter breaking off)...

 

The tractor will never be worth putting a new engine in, as far as diminishing returns...much like any 30 year old GT...so its not a question of value as much as one vs the other...im stuck.  I can order the onan today and have it in a week...vs waiting for maybe the Vanguard at some time...but i cant do both.

[lynnmor 7,479]

Put the used Onan in and maintain it, many go thousands of hours.  You will also have a bucket of spare parts if needed.

[RED-Z06 2,379]

23 minutes ago, lynnmor said:

Put the used Onan in and maintain it, many go thousands of hours.  You will also have a bucket of spare parts if needed.

Maintenance and hours aren't the problem with 220s...the seats on the filter side fall out and you dont know it unil its beaten the block up, mine ran really well somehow with about...0.050" of seat movement 🥲.  Ive come across 4 220s locally or at least in driving distance and so far all 4 under 900 hours had at least 1 bad seat.  I do like the idea of having spare parts but not the idea of having to need spare parts.  Also dont want to have to drop 2200 into something im already into $2500

[WHX?? 49,919]

I would repo. Don't get me wrong I too love the power of a fine running Onan but there ain't shop around here for 400 miles that would touch it so that means I DIY. Which is no problem. I have a decent machinist in my back pocket and I know the whole thing would be done right. The biggy for me is the cost of parts.

Personally I would do a predator or if the rest of the tractor was in really good shape and I am in love with her might spring for the Vanguard.  I would never do a used Onan unless I was 200% sure I had a warm fuzzy feeling about it. 

Know where yer coming from Red... been there. 

[RED-Z06 2,379]

1 hour ago, WHX?? said:

I would repo. Don't get me wrong I too love the power of a fine running Onan but there ain't shop around here for 400 miles that would touch it so that means I DIY. Which is no problem. I have a decent machinist in my back pocket and I know the whole thing would be done right. The biggy for me is the cost of parts.

Personally I would do a predator or if the rest of the tractor was in really good shape and I am in love with her might spring for the Vanguard.  I would never do a used Onan unless I was 200% sure I had a warm fuzzy feeling about it. 

Know where yer coming from Red... been there. 

The only problem with the predator is its not a bolt in kit, you have to modify the exhaust quite a bit, figure out the 1" to 1-⁷/16 crank adapter, figure out the driveshaft adapter and raise the engine 1.5"...on top of the electrical connector and having to go to a ground kill ignition switch.  Its not bad its just...stuff

[Heatingman 971]

Its mainly a question of what you do with the power.

 

just mow? more? 
 

have lots of attachments for the machine?

 

2200 is a ton of money in my view especially all at once. 
 

Not sure what I would do. But if Onan motors are that finicky I would steer away from a used one.

 

 

 

 

[oliver2-44 10,077]

Have you considered outing a Kohler twin or single in it. A K341 will power a 48” deck or plow no problem

[davem1111 2,073]

My GT-1848 has a Honda GX610 engine on it. Previous owner did it, not me. I like it a lot, but the stock muffler is high so they had to cut the hood to make it fit, plus they used PT 2x4 wood as spacers to raise it up, which I plan to replace with steel at some point and I have plans to replace the stock muffler with a single stack and repair & repaint the hood. This Honda engine was supposedly a WH "sanctioned" replacement for dealers, I dunno.

 

I also have a 416-8 and a 416-H with Onan engines, and I like those okay too. If you were nearby I might consider selling you one of those tractors just for the engine - they both run well but I don't know how many hours are on them. It would probably net me more than I could sell one for any time soon, and still get you a good engine for a decent price. But for sure, not with shipping thrown into the mix. 

[RED-Z06 2,379]

1 hour ago, oliver2-44 said:

Have you considered outing a Kohler twin or single in it. A K341 will power a 48” deck or plow no problem

 

This unit has a 60" shaft driven deck, it needs at least the 20hp it had stock.  The P224 would have been appropriate but physically doesnt fit

[RED-Z06 2,379]

1 hour ago, Heatingman said:

Its mainly a question of what you do with the power.

 

just mow? more? 
 

have lots of attachments for the machine?

 

2200 is a ton of money in my view especially all at once. 
 

Not sure what I would do. But if Onan motors are that finicky I would steer away from a used one.

 

 

 

 

My dream when i got it was to put a Little Buck loader on it, it has a 60" shaft driven deck, and a 3pt is still available.  2200 is steep.  Tractor only shows like 760hrs on a working meter, its a Shame the Onan died so young.

[Heatingman 971]

11 minutes ago, RED-Z06 said:

My dream when i got it was to put a Little Buck loader on it, it has a 60" shaft driven deck, and a 3pt is still available.  2200 is steep.  Tractor only shows like 760hrs on a working meter, its a Shame the Onan died so young.

For a little more, id buy something like this instead:

 

[Heatingman 971]

Heres one with a loader for 2700

 

[Pullstart 63,529]

@RED-Z06 what model are we talking about here?  P220 told me 520H but shaft drive?  Xi?  Not ?  They have crank adapters for the driveshaft flange available for the Predators… and it would still get you driving new for less than $1k.

 

For exhaust, do you have a welder?  If not, pick one of those up and find yourself some swap meet V8 headers to cut up and use to build the exhaust.  It’s pretty fun!

 

You could do this for less than $2200 and be ahead on tools.

 

 

Edited October 25, 2022 by Pullstart

[WHX?? 49,919]

55 minutes ago, Pullstart said:

-Z06 what model are we talking about here?  P220 told me 520H but shaft drive?  Xi?  Not ?  

520 jumped in my head but shaft drive deck? Crank run fore and after? A buddy did a predator in a Massey 1850 but it was a frame off resto build. Didn't have to worry about running a deck. 

[Red-Bovine 325]

I replace the P220 on our 1992 520H back in 2013 with a Honda GX630 from Repower Specialists in Eugene, OR. The engine and kit was about 2K back then. It has been great and reliable. Got tired of valve seats coming loose, Yes, I really like the Onan, but the Honda is great.

[RED-Z06 2,379]

Its a non wheel horse unfortunately, can't find XI models anywhere here, and 520s are rare as hens teeth.  

[RED-Z06 2,379]

25 minutes ago, Red-Bovine said:

I replace the P220 on our 1992 520H back in 2013 with a Honda GX630 from Repower Specialists in Eugene, OR. The engine and kit was about 2K back then. It has been great and reliable. Got tired of valve seats coming loose, Yes, I really like the Onan, but the Honda is great.

The GX honda was an option for replacement but at the moment also unavailable...but they have shot up to 2799, the Kohler is 3199 last i looked...its gotten ridiculous 

[kpinnc 13,105]

You'll lose most of your instrumentation (unless you change some guages and wiring), but I'm a believer in Vanguards. I have four of them, and they are good engines.

 

We'll never get K-series or Onans again, so comparisons are hit and miss at best. Vanguards are a solid replacement. They have thier own issues like any engine, but they are solid. 

 

 

[RED-Z06 2,379]

14 minutes ago, kpinnc said:

You'll lose most of your instrumentation (unless you change some guages and wiring), but I'm a believer in Vanguards. I have four of them, and they are good engines.

 

We'll never get K-series or Onans again, so comparisons are hit and miss at best. Vanguards are a solid replacement. They have thier own issues like any engine, but they are solid. 

 

 

Oh yeah, rebuilt many over 2500 hours with 0 bore wear, just needing rings and seals...very robust engines.  My only gripe is the displacement...23hp 633cc is considerably smaller than many other similarly rated engines...725cc kohler for example, 690cc honda.  They have great power in spite of the disadvantage though..and sip gas

[davem1111 2,073]

3 hours ago, RED-Z06 said:

The GX honda was an option for replacement but at the moment also unavailable...but they have shot up to 2799, the Kohler is 3199 last i looked...its gotten ridiculous 

 

Yikes!  

[RED-Z06 2,379]

1 minute ago, davem1111 said:

 

Yikes!  

 

[Snoopy11 5,717]

6 minutes ago, RED-Z06 said:

 

 

RUN!

 

18 hours ago, RED-Z06 said:

something im already into $2500

 

How exactly did you get $2,500 in?

 

For the prices I have seen in this thread... you could easily just drop a comparable Honda in it and call it a day...

 

https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200431131_200431131?cm_mmc=Bing-pla&cmpid=53403377&agid=3200075887&tgtid=pla-4577885386322947&prdid=166134&msclkid=c3b8ff682f431b8160459c3039619691&gclsrc=ds

 

Don

[Snoopy11 5,717]

Duromax is another exceptional option... (ask me how I know)...

 

https://www.amazon.com/DuroMax-XP23HPE-Blue/dp/B089KVXRYZ/ref=asc_df_B089KVXRYZ?tag=bngsmtphsnus-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=80470624769013&hvnetw=s&hvqmt=e&hvbmt=be&hvdev=c&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=&hvtargid=pla-4584070154420702&psc=1

 

Don

[Snoopy11 5,717]

Another option, Lifan...

 

https://www.amazon.com/Lifan-LF2V78-2DQSC-Industrial-4-Stroke-Electric/dp/B00CYDO3EK/ref=sr_1_4?keywords=v-twin+engine&qid=1666718099&qu=eyJxc2MiOiIyLjk1IiwicXNhIjoiMi40MiIsInFzcCI6IjAuMDAifQ%3D%3D&s=lawn-garden&sr=1-4

 

Don

[RED-Z06 2,379]

16 minutes ago, Snoopy11 said:

 

RUN!

 

 

How exactly did you get $2,500 in?

 

For the prices I have seen in this thread... you could easily just drop a comparable Honda in it and call it a day...

 

https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200431131_200431131?cm_mmc=Bing-pla&cmpid=53403377&agid=3200075887&tgtid=pla-4577885386322947&prdid=166134&msclkid=c3b8ff682f431b8160459c3039619691&gclsrc=ds

 

Don

Paid 2000 for the tractor, then did the Onan flyball spacer, ignition switch, restored the deck, deck wheels, paint correction, seat..