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Greetings everyone! I hope everyone is well! Merry Christmas and Happy Holiday's! Howard messaged me last night and wanted to tell everyone to dust off your mash pole signs for the BIG SHOW. He is feeling better and is building a new mash pole. Your signs need to be 4"x12" (same as old signs) and need to be free of sharp edges/corners. Sign should include Name, home town, and distance driven. I think it goes with out saying that no yellow/green signs allowed. For those of you not familiar with what a M.A.S.H. pole, click on the googlator and type it in. You should see some examples. That's it! Maybe one of these days Howard will figure out how to reset his redsquare password Mods, if you need to move this to the WHCC show part of this forum, feel free to do so. James

Howdy all ,Well I Stopped by my scrap buddy place and low and behold had to rescue another one from his cutting torch , Seems to be a 1973 Automatic 16 , everything seems solid even the steering is nice and tight , the mule is there but no deck ,engine spins free . tires are pretty good also , fluids do not look bad , all hydraulic parts are in tack, missing the fuel tank but other then that seems like a nice solid unmolested WH . Have not had the chance to finish the Hydraulics on my C120 so need to get to that first before I start reviving this one , my plan was to finish the C120 test my home made gravel road grader with it , then break down the c120 for paint ,but I will hold of on the break down and paint, get this Auto 16 up and running then tear them both down and paint them at the same time .

The wife and I just returned from a week in Zanzibar. What a trip! Resort was beautiful and so much to see. Freddie Mercury was born here while his parents worked at the British consulate. So of course there is a museum. The resort even had the correct make of lawn mower! IMG_0607.mp4 Aldabra tortoise preserve. The numbers on their backs indicates their age in years. You can't see the number on Papa, but he's 196! Swam with sea turtles in a natural aquarium where fishermen bring turtles that get caught in their nets. Dolphin spotting while we were out on the water! IMG_0545.mp4 Highlight of the trip was the day trip that we took to mainland Tanzania for a safari in Mikumi National Park! Seeing the wildlife like this in their natural habitat was amazing! IMG_0749.mp4 IMG_0764.mp4

I'm thinking about going to look at this John Deere LA. It will need a few things, i.e. the fuel tank needs cleaning, a battery, etc. It comes with rear weights and cultivators. For those who aren't familiar with the Y, 62, L and LA John Deeres, they were the smallest farm tractor JD made. They came out in the late '30s and were made until around 1946. The first units had a Hercules engine and then a Deere designed Hercules engine, and finally a Deere engine, all vertical 2 cylinder engines. The LA differed from the L in that it had more heavier duty tubes (later ones had a solid tube), a more powerful engine, and weighed about 700 lbs more than the L. They're not the most powerful (the LA about 13-14 hp on the drawbar) and the L weighed about 1500 lbs while LA weighed in at around 2200 lbs. The LA I might look at has the solid tube frame as seen in the pictures.

In the past few years, I've tried 4 different methods of LED light replacements. Let me say first that though some are better than others, ALL of them far exceed OEM light options so far as output is concerned. They also have very low power consumption, don't get hot, and are claimed to last thousands of hours. So far none of mine have needed replacement. There are some people who prefer incandescent traditional bulbs over LEDs, and I do not intend to try to sell them something new. We all have differing opinions, and that is the way it should be. There is also the argument for keeping these machines as close to original as possible. This thread is not intended to challenge any of those opinions. What this thread is intended to do, is offer some insight into what I've found in some testing for those of us who still work these machines, and look to improve where we can their capabilities. Make no mistake- LEDs greatly increase light output in front of your machine, and do so economically and safely. All of my tractors have one of two types of lights: the PAR 36 style on 300/400/500 series tractors, and the automotive turn signal type in most everything Wheel Horse manufactured between 1965 and 1984. This thread focuses mainly on those. I plan to do some comparison pictures and add to this thread. Some side by side comparisons will be added later as well. The PAR-36 versions are the simplest modification. You just replace the OEM lights with LEDs. If you go to SuperBrightLEDs.com and search "PAR 36", you'll find several options. The older style lights require some modifications. There are many options, and each requires different levels of modification. Remember that "warmer" colors below 4500 are more yellow like incandescent, and "cooler" above 5500 are whiter, and even lean into bluish colors above 6000. Combine this with lumen ratings (which are NOT standardized), and it can be confusing. To be honest, most any LEDs are brighter than traditional lights on these tractors, so I doubt this thread will help much there. There are more options than there are shoe sizes, and they vary between seller just as much. I'll be adding some mods that I have done as well in the next few days.

What you've described...loss of power at operating temp...is typical of pump internal parts wear. I don't know that the fluid change you allude to will resolve that issue and I'd expect the 'sluggish' condition to only worsen. After all, the Chg 12 is now 51 years old and parts just plain wear out...eventually. To overhaul the pump is not a difficult task...if you can manage a wrench, you can manage the overhaul. Your unit, if original, has the Sundstrand HydroGear power unit model 90-2046. I've prepared a .pdf file with narrative and pics of what to do...free for download at your leisure. The file name is SUNDSTRAND HYDROGEAR refurb.pdf. Another file from Sundstrand is : Transmission_Sundstrand_Hydrogear_Piston-Piston_1965-1982. Both of these are in the TRANSMISSION section for download. Here are a couple pics of what you'll find inside the Pump...

As an added anecdote to this exchange... Back when I lived in South Bend, I worked for a manufacturing company in a town about 20 miles south of there. They had been in business since the 1950's and had experienced enough growth that they had outgrown their initial building. In the mid 1990's they were looking to expand significantly. Some of the processes took up quite a bit of space, so finding a big, open building was a must. Since they provided component parts to many OEM industrial and agricultural equipment manufacturers they had to keep a lot of inventory in stock to make sure these customers were able to provide fast response to breakdowns in the field, production changes, etc. So they also needed decent warehousing space for finished product. The input raw materials for the manufacturing processes were big and bulky and it was economically smart to buy as much as possible in truckload quantities to get price breaks. So, they needed a lot of storage space for that too. They looked around quite a bit and really didn't find any great options. But there was this one plant on the south side of South Bend that seemed to check all the boxes. It was big. It had a lot of open spans. It had a lot of loading docks. It was already divided up for manufacturing and warehousing. It had lots of power. Great location. Really, an ideal place. And the price was apparently a pretty decent deal. South Bend was certainly past its economic boom by that time and there really weren't many manufacturing outfits looking to move into the area. What was there was either already dead, gone, or was limping along. The last box to check was to have the site assessed for environmental problems...and it wasn't good. Nothing insurmountable, but cleanup is always expensive and there's always the risk of discovering that the initial findings were just the tip of the iceberg. It appeared that the prior owner had lost a few things into the ground over the years. Really not a surprise since things were different in the 1960's than they were in modern times. What was acceptable practice then just doesn't fly these days. and with CERCLA in play, it pays to be careful and minimize risks and liabilities.. So, they moved on and ended up building a new building to really suit the manufacturing needs. Worked out well. Another buyer came along for the other site and transformed it into their operations. I imagine that the seller and they probably came to some agreements on what to do with the environmental issues. The outfit that occupies the building now is by all accounts and reputation a world-class operation. Just like the former occupant: Wheel Horse Products inc. Steve

Paint the new compressor Wheel Horse red and the wife wont take notice.

When comparing CFM, be sure that you take into account the PSI where it is rated, example: 13.4 CFM at 40 PSI 11.5 CFM at 90 PSI

Saw ad on CL for "wheel house" parts. Drove about 100 miles south to Cape Coral. Tag shows 655 serial #133946. Has original Techy H60 on it but is a mess. Got an 8 horsepower k181 and a 12 horse, as well as two RD decks and the transaxle with what seller said was four speed with hi - lo range? I only wanted 8 horse and decks but it was a package. Any thoughts on that tranny? No idea what it came off of.

We have an LA in the collection that my dad left to us kids. Fun little tractor. The serial number on them was on a tag that was riveted to the rear axle, like ours they are most commonly gone. The one that you posted pictures of is missing the roll pan in the front under the grill. These had to be removed to install some implements and again like ours, they are commonly missing. One up grade that I made on ours was to run a wire from the magneto to a switch that could be reached from the drivers seat so that the engine could be shut off without dismounting the tractor. Other wise you had to get off from the tractor, walk to the side and push the tab on the mag to shut it off. I did not feel that this was safe while exhibiting at a tractor show with people around.

Cubic Feet Minute/ CFM This cannot be stressed enough, that feature should be THE guide for you in any purchase of an air compressor!!! Horsepower, PSI, tank size, etc are all secondary factors. If you are gonna run air tools or a blast cabinet, then to be able to run these properly you need one with, at a minimum, 10-12cfm - even better is over 15cfm. (to get this I would believe you would need a 2 stage pump) A blast cabinet in particular is an 'air hog'. My 80gal, 5hp is rated at 19cfm and when using it on a large item it will often run constantly. Even the little - very handy die grinders - will gulp a lot of air. Paint gun, nail gun, blow gun, air tires, etc, most any of them will do. Having said that, fooling with/rebuilding these horses, (like so many of us do) a blast cabinet has to be one of the most useful tools I have. At the age of most - all? of them have been left outside, not maintained properly, etc etc, getting those rusted, gunked up parts cleaned is made SO much easier with a good compressor and cabinet.

Not sure I can justify a $1500 compressor. I guess if I can justify 11 tractors on less than 1/2 acre...........

The HP rating is for the motor on the compressor. Electric motor HP rating have always confused me a bit. Example : the 220v 5hp motor on a Rol-Air compressor is about twice the size and weight of the 220v 5hp motor on my Sandborn compressor. Both motor are supposed to have the same HP, granted the duty cycle on the Sandborn is lower. When sizing a compressor to a tool, pay no attention to the HP rating of the compressor. CFM (cubic feet per minute) is what really matters. If the CFM on your compressor is not at or above the CFM required for the tool then it will not keep up under constant use of the tool.

Same here! I put a Kohler carb on a Lawn Ranger years back, and was riding around so proudly in my yard. Then my neighbor walked over and asked me if the tractor was something I bought for my kids... I quickly put it away. Not sure I've used a Ranger since.

Top post, side post, bolt on ears, wing nuts, the type of connection for the battery means nothing. As long as it is a 12v battery.

You can't. Part of the CERCLA (Superfund) law is that anybody who has or ever had any ownership of the property can be held liable for contamination whether they had anything to do with the contamination or not. So if the site is dirty and you own it, it could be your problem. Even if you can prove the contamination isn't from you, that doesn't necessarily get you off the hook. This seems unfair, but it's held up in court. The obvious intent is to make sure any and all owners do the right thing. You can have the site tested. Don't go for a low bidder on this. Have a couple of environmental engineering firms give you a bid. If you or the seller hire one they'll drill a bunch of cores all around the property and look for things. It will be expensive. They usually have to have some idea what they are looking for or they'll do a shotgun approach and test for everything which is expensive. Test the groundwater under the site. Look for buried treasure in the form of waste piles or underground tanks. We just went through this at work a couple of years ago. We have a big building on a 13-acre site that used to be operated by a giant paper-making company. A crew spent many days here sinking core drills and wells all over the place looking for trouble. They located an underground tank we didn't know we had. We were fortunate to find nothing embarrassing or illegal on the grounds and the ownership breathed a huge sigh of relief. Chances are, unless the fertilizer people were scumbags the site will be clean enough to be within regulations. I can't think of anything fertilizer-related that is especially pernicious and agriculture related activities in general are held to very lax standards compared to every other industry. Get a lawyer to give you sound advice. Do not listen to real estate agents, buddies, or guys on the internet (ahem...). Steve

I have been using one of these for about 20yrs. This one says Master Force but I'm quite sure that it is made by Sandborn. Probably not the right compressor if you were running a business but it is a good compressor for most home shops. First thing that I did to mine was to reset the pressure switch so that it shuts down at 125psi and kicks back in at 100psi, I thought that 155psi was a little over board for a single stage compressor. Some tools that I have will over run the compressor, 4"grinder, mud hog, & sandblaster but I never have to wait very long for it to catch up. https://www.menards.com/main/tools/air-compressors/masterforce-reg-belt-drive-60-gallon-155-psi-stationary-electric-vertical-air-compressor/mela3706056/p-1444439609007-c-12910.htm?tid=-4007114158737362003&ipos=1

In another thread @Achto posted a video where a guy modified a set of duckbill pliers into a hand bender for Z-bends on control wires: So even though I have a Z-bender tool 'somewhere', I decided to make a pair like that. Thumbing through my tool box for a suitable set of junk donor pliers I came across these which I've had for ages. No idea where they came from, I know I didn't buy them, they just sort of appeared out of the air. Searched the interwebs for this model of plier and came up with NADA. I never knew what these were for. I thought maybe for twisting wires or something like that. Anyway, I decided to cut a notch in these to make the Z-bend tool and I gotta say, they work perfectly! By offsetting the notch to one side one can make two different depths of z-bend. The pliers would likely still work for their intended purpose, whatever that is / was. Does anyone know what these would have been used for?

I'm always looking for a C-160, and you find one in a scrap heap? You did well!

Actually Eric they used at least 3 different tanks these are all 68/69 Chargers The steel tank is small and since she now has a k-341 and a blower it doesn't last long. Can't swap tanks as the hood stand is different the shelfi s too short...

A group 22NFD is a garden tractor battery that has top post like a automotive battery. This is the stock size battery for my Raider 12. They are a little more spendy than the U1 G.T. batteries https://www.fleetfarm.com/detail/road-runner-lawn-garden-battery-grp-22-12-mo-360-cca/0000000282379?bc=12937|13885|13892

I agree about holding off on painting it. Power wash it and break out the elbow grease. That paint will clean up nicely.

The size and terminal type wouldn't cause any issues. Older WH came with full size batteries and clamp on terminals.... Excessively ling cranking can cause issues with the starter motor

Great tractor. And if it's going to be stored inside you can keep the patina. Paint is over rated.....

The one and only time that a WH owner appreciates the steering wheel being so hard to remove...

James and Howard, that is the best news I've heard in a long time.

Just imagine, if a cleanup is needed, there’s reason for a hoe machine and a loader machine, a dumper machine and various other landscape attachments!

Have the owner pull some soil samples and have them tested before you buy it. This would be the only way to know for sure that there is nothing in the ground. Or - If no body has said anything to him in the last 10yrs, I don't think it would be an issue. 60k is a good price for a building that size. I messed around too long & missed out on a huge building practically in my back yard that went for 50k. Smack my self in the head every time I look out my back window at it.

That is a bad pinch point on most reciprocating saws. Getting rid of that stupid allen screw was also one of the best improvement's that Milwaukee ever did with the Sawzall. Don't know how many screw heads I stripped out on those trying to get the blade to hold tight. The new quick lock is much faster and the blade actually stays in the saw, I've had similar stare downs with a bad situation. Like working up the courage to finish running a fish hook from a musky lure through my hand. Caught a fair sized northern and when I went to take it out of the net it slashed around and stuck the lure in me. The hook was in past the barb & would not pull back out. So I finally pushed it through the rest of the way so that I could cut the barb off with the small bolt cutters (that I always keep in the boat ) and remove it from my hand. Besides a little blood loss I was fine, thought that the guy fishing with me was gonna pass out though.

I used foil tape on the Charger bezel, and it worked OK.

I wouldn't wish injury on anyone. That being said, I imagine someone holding the clutch down, tractor full throttle and in 3rd gear, adjusting the seat RIGHT OFF THE BACK OF THE TRACTOR!!!. Tractor takes off, sans seat, leaving the driver sitting on the seat still, but on the ground.

So this morning I was at work minding my own business, when a couple of the hands who work for the county came in to order some grader tires. Got to talking with them, and as it usually goes with me the conversation soon turned to antique tractors. Turns out that someone gave this old Oliver to the fire department to be crushed with a bunch of other junk vehicles. One of the guys was telling me about it and said they set it aside to see if I wanted it before they crushed it. The poor old thing is in pretty rough shape, engine is stuck and I'm sure it's bad inside, as it has been sitting outside for years with an open exhaust and missing 4 spark plugs. Missing several other parts as well, but I didn't have the heart to let it get crushed and be sent off to China to be made into junk. I was prepared to buy it for scrap price or a little over from the fire department, but was told I could have it as long as I brought something in exchange for it. As it turns out I happen to have a junk 2000 Silverado that's not worth fixing anymore, I just haven't taken the time to load it up and make the 65 mile trip to the scrapyard with it yet. So one day next week I'm gonna load it up on the trailer and haul it to the county barn to trade it for the tractor. Not sure what I'm ever gonna do with the old tractor, it's probably too far gone for my finances to be able to bring it back to life, but maybe I can find someone who can do something with it, or maybe parts of it can be used to save another one, no matter what happens at least it won't be crushed and melted down, and that makes me happy.

I haven't done any real work in so long, my hands are clean. That's disgusting.

This from Save Old Iron (chuck) Marv Battery Discussion Info.docx

We cut up about 5 lbs of hind quarters last night and prepared them for jerky in the smoker. We just laid them out and I’ll check them in a couple hours. Recipe one is Tajín Mexican spice and garlic powder. Recipe two is fresh ground black pepper, garlic powder and lemon peel infused sea salt. Mesquite for the chips.

Thanks Dan. I went back and corrected that. 👍

Nice save! I see that it has the clevis hitch and with hydro lift that is a plus! I would love to have a lift one on my 414-8 when I am using the garden equipment.

I've seen a few of those older ones with those top post cables. I don't know if they were OE WH or not. I do actually have several automotive group 51 batteries and those are top posts and they will fit along with a group 22NF. Properly operating starting and charging system will only draw what it needs so putting a bigger battery in doesn't hurt anything.

Excellent save! Very highly desirable model for those that know what they're looking for...

It's currently sitting on the wrong side, but it's easier for pics on this side. The shiny horizontal line is a lite score mark from the grinder. Probably not needed but I put it there in hopes it makes the bed look smaller by making it look like it has a filler panel under it. On to round 2........

Well that sure was an interesting collection to pick up. The transmission is definitely an 8-speed. Seat/fuel tank support brackets suggest a C, a 300 or a 400. If the axles are 1 ⅛" then a 500? Lots of possibilities.

Time to create a shell company to own it!

They are cool old tractors even if they are green Hope it works out for you

Yes, I think $1500 might be $1000 too much for that one. To be fair, they are listed for that. But they ALL are listed for that. I dont know at what rate they are selling, but it would be hard to offer them $100 when they are listing for that price. As much of a pain as electrics can be, I'm an electrical engineer so I would probably stick with electric. Maybe give it a 'boost'. I badly want an electric tractor, but being an engineer, nothing is good enough in its stock form, I would have to make it better.

Yes sir you are correct! Huge difference in govenor response! This, and adding the spring between governor arm and throttle made a massive difference in the Charger's performance. Plain and simple- these machines have wear in the linkages aside from internal wear. You can get a good runner, but sometimes they need a little extra to keep going!

Didn't have to quarantine if fully vaxed. Masks were only really required in the resort restaurants except when seated at your table. Even with that, we had to take PCR tests within 72 hours prior to departure of our flight both over and back. In country we scheduled with a mobile doctor that came around to the resorts and hotels and did the test on site. Interestingly enough, Zanzibar customs checked all of our paperwork and vax records when we arrived before they let us in the country, however, even though we had all our documents completed for the return, U.S. customs didn't ask for any of it. We both have Global Entry and all we had to do was give them the receipt from the Global entry kiosk just like normal.

Yep that's a nasty one G. Just for a little inspiration guy I saved this one. She is a bit noisy due to the lost clearances between gears but she went into a show ride around and light duty worker. I am missing why you had to bust the fork to get it apart tho? Input shaft issues or the shift rails brown welded? Got a little pic heavy... I'm not sorry... you know how pic happy these guys are. Use your shout out you need parts or help. Note the last pic the TWO drain plugs. I drill and tap another one for the over the hump drain. Also highly recommend installing magnetic plugs. I make my own.

You should try one of these Yeah I know it’s the wrong color. That will be fixed later. I have 3 of these things.